Snakat wrote:

ninjamansean wrote: EXACTLY!!!

If I can get him ranked higher that would fix the issue.
I understand that has happened with others and was hoping someone would know more about this topic.

That had feeling
Is it a issue? Is'n it just part of his "mission", don't know really the word to use, so it would be a natural part of it?
I don't know how much you could help, beside being helped. You said it's an angel and for what I know, and it's not much since the only one I have is a fallen one, they guide people and help them to be better. They would probably need to help more than one people or do something really big. I could try to talk with my fallen about this :think:

Terror Misu wrote:Just pure speculation:

When an ancient djinn evolves and ascends to khodam status, what gets them there? Maybe through the good they do using their powers. I dunno. WHy else would they step forward and work with humans? Not all djinn are duplicituous - they are grey-natured like humans and can choose to do "good" or "bad" with their powers... the ones that are ancient and evolved ascend... maybe the nature of their relationship with humans has to do with this ascension issue. This is something I've thought about in my spare time.. I have nothing to base this is on, so it is just pure speculation.

I did read about they becoming Khodam in another post but didn't take a position in opinion to this, since ascend don't need to be to white direction. But for what I got they can rise ranks realizing wishs and that is one of the reasong they help humans, not saying is the only one. The best way is ask directly, what I can also try.

Would love to read what other people angels and djinn have to say.

I think that's an interesting thing to say - ascension doesn't have to be in a white direction. That made me pause and I actually spent the last few days mulling over it. Here's my take on it -- I'll have to disagree with a bit but mainly because I'm more of the right hand path (and I recognize this in coloring my perspective which is why I am telling all of you as a bit of a disclaimer). I think this is definitely a case of semantics since you spoke with your fallen angel and you got the sense that you may not have been using the correct terms or asking the right questions... one can distinguish between rank and ascension... rank, maybe, can be used in reference to angel rankings or demon rankings... when I'm talking about djinn evolution to khodam (angelic status), I'm thinking ascension...same as a human being, a regular mortal, who dies and ascends to ascended master status, kind of like St. Germaine or Jesus Christ or Yogananda. I'm not quite sure if I'm able to articulate what I"m thinking... but hopefully you get the gist of what I'm speculating. Just my 2 cents.

Terror Misu wrote: I think that's an interesting thing to say - ascension doesn't have to be in a white direction. That made me pause and I actually spent the last few days mulling over it. Here's my take on it -- I'll have to disagree with a bit but mainly because I'm more of the right hand path (and I recognize this in coloring my perspective which is why I am telling all of you as a bit of a disclaimer). I think this is definitely a case of semantics since you spoke with your fallen angel and you got the sense that you may not have been using the correct terms or asking the right questions... one can distinguish between rank and ascension... rank, maybe, can be used in reference to angel rankings or demon rankings... when I'm talking about djinn evolution to khodam (angelic status), I'm thinking ascension...same as a human being, a regular mortal, who dies and ascends to ascended master status, kind of like St. Germaine or Jesus Christ or Yogananda. I'm not quite sure if I'm able to articulate what I"m thinking... but hopefully you get the gist of what I'm speculating. Just my 2 cents.

I see what you are trying to say, I think it can be semantics so I'm going try to explaing my line of thought to about this. About my fallen, I had this idea because he said things are planned but aren't destiny or fate, so this mean another term, and some other things. About ascencion, I believe it's not pute white. This of course is taking from my own pespective, I don't follow a left hand path, but I also don't believe staying white is the right answer. Ascending for me is an state of evolution that can happen as white, dark or black. If you think there's the same level of evolution and acknowledge in being of all this classification, the difference is their choice (or not so much) of how to work. For me white and black don't have free will, they aren't capable of a oposite choice, and in white case they don't fight either. So for me make sense to think ascended masters as dark since they have free will and can defend thenselfs. Hope this help to explain my point, don't want to get it long and steal the tread.

Snakat wrote:

Terror Misu wrote: I think that's an interesting thing to say - ascension doesn't have to be in a white direction. That made me pause and I actually spent the last few days mulling over it. Here's my take on it -- I'll have to disagree with a bit but mainly because I'm more of the right hand path (and I recognize this in coloring my perspective which is why I am telling all of you as a bit of a disclaimer). I think this is definitely a case of semantics since you spoke with your fallen angel and you got the sense that you may not have been using the correct terms or asking the right questions... one can distinguish between rank and ascension... rank, maybe, can be used in reference to angel rankings or demon rankings... when I'm talking about djinn evolution to khodam (angelic status), I'm thinking ascension...same as a human being, a regular mortal, who dies and ascends to ascended master status, kind of like St. Germaine or Jesus Christ or Yogananda. I'm not quite sure if I'm able to articulate what I"m thinking... but hopefully you get the gist of what I'm speculating. Just my 2 cents.

I see what you are trying to say, I think it can be semantics so I'm going try to explaing my line of thought to about this. About my fallen, I had this idea because he said things are planned but aren't destiny or fate, so this mean another term, and some other things. About ascencion, I believe it's not pute white. This of course is taking from my own pespective, I don't follow a left hand path, but I also don't believe staying white is the right answer. Ascending for me is an state of evolution that can happen as white, dark or black. If you think there's the same level of evolution and acknowledge in being of all this classification, the difference is their choice (or not so much) of how to work. For me white and black don't have free will, they aren't capable of a oposite choice, and in white case they don't fight either. So for me make sense to think ascended masters as dark since they have free will and can defend thenselfs. Hope this help to explain my point, don't want to get it long and steal the tread.

Hmmm.. very interesting. I recognize the limitations of my righthand path perspective... the grey-natured issue is what I'm referencing, that you have a djinn who evolves to khodam status, which is more in a "white" direction... you also have the case of Archangel Metatron who used to be a mortal man named Enoch until "God" elevated him to archangel status.

I would be interested in hearing examples of ascension from a dark perspective, meaning, from demon to god knows what... can you "evolve" in the opposite direction of white towards Satan, however one wants to personify Satan/Lucifer and argue that this is ascension? I would tentatively say at this juncture, no. It isn't ascension...and speculate that ascension means raising one's vibration to the frequency of the angels and other beings of white light, closer to the divine and all things we personify as God/Goddess/the Universe. This is why the term "fallen angel" infers an angel who has been banished from the angelic realm and has lost its former "rank" as well as "descended" to something else altogether.

Don't meant to get off tangent here from Sean's original question but sometimes these discussions head in really fascinating directions and I have to jump on this tangent Plus, it's like... in order to get to Sean's question, we have to backtrack and figure out "What does one mean, how does one define spiritual evolution and ascension?" What I'm finding out is that it isn't as clear cut as it may appear.

Intriguing points, Snakat.

I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you're asking.

Since "Spirit" tends to be a word used in lieu of more appropriate terminology, I want to be sure you are talking about an actual spirit (the essence of a once, living being), and not talking about a soul (unique aspect of a living being that ascends to an afterlife), or an entity (still living on their respective realm).

creepyhollows wrote:I'm not sure I'm fully understanding what you're asking.

Since "Spirit" tends to be a word used in lieu of more appropriate terminology, I want to be sure you are talking about an actual spirit (the essence of a once, living being), and not talking about a soul (unique aspect of a living being that ascends to an afterlife), or an entity (still living on their respective realm).

I have been vague on purpose. I have a bound living entity which is 1/2 angel and I know what role I am to play. I would very much like to someway get it elevated. I could send you a fully descriptive email, I have been afraid to thinking Princess will delete prior to your reading it. By the way my 1/2 angel informed me of a 30 generational curse which answered my questions about why things are the way for my bloodline.

Terror Misu wrote: Hmmm.. very interesting. I recognize the limitations of my righthand path perspective... the grey-natured issue is what I'm referencing, that you have a djinn who evolves to khodam status, which is more in a "white" direction... you also have the case of Archangel Metatron who used to be a mortal man named Enoch until "God" elevated him to archangel status.

I separed to pieces to see if we can talk more than, I find ascension an very interesting subject and don't mind reading other pespectives. And for exactly this I'll try to expand more. I don't think the righthand path is wrong or limited, I supose it could be if the person get blind and don't see anything else but I read enought of your posts to know this is not the case and this could happen in any kind of path. I think we all have more affinities to one path and they are all necessary to balance. I don't believe in good and evil but I do believe in different energies like positive and negative, positive only can exist because of negative and vice-versa. Is this pressure of them going "against" each other that makes change and without it goes back to inexistence. So it could never be just white or just black, because they wouldn't exist. That is why dark/grey is kind of important in my opinion, it's the mix of both and mean having a choice. I have the book of Enoch and know about his change to archangel, this is book I want to reread now that I know more.

Terror Misu wrote:I would be interested in hearing examples of ascension from a dark perspective, meaning, from demon to god knows what... can you "evolve" in the opposite direction of white towards Satan, however one wants to personify Satan/Lucifer and argue that this is ascension? I would tentatively say at this juncture, no. It isn't ascension...and speculate that ascension means raising one's vibration to the frequency of the angels and other beings of white light, closer to the divine and all things we personify as God/Goddess/the Universe. This is why the term "fallen angel" infers an angel who has been banished from the angelic realm and has lost its former "rank" as well as "descended" to something else altogether.

I don't consider Satan a being, it's a tittle that mean opposer, so in a way everybody is satan of someone. Satan was only made a being years later, so I can't do nothing but wonder about his existence since anyone could clain this tittle. When I say ascencion in a dark path I also don't mean ascencion to a position to mean like Lucifer and maybe is better to explain ascension to me here. For me, ascension don't mean getting in the level of angelic vibration but getting in a level of not only acknowledge but mastery and where you are total responssible for your actions in the sense you accept the consequence of them, you suppose for some was getting to be your higher-self. I guess the terms God/Goddess/Universe could be used to and they really aren't white either is just look around, I see the "creator" as a force and without personality but the Gods and Goddess are emanation of it just like us, and if we work to it we can become like them. But you would have the decision in you path in doing this to become a white being and lose free will or to stay a dark being and keep free will. Luicfer is thought immortal to talk about, but I don't see him as evil and he doesn't feel evil but he have a part to play. Again for them there's no such a thing as good and evil but balance. When talking about fallen angels is complicated, my fallen for example got cast out because he married a human and this was forbidden. He doesn't regret it because he loved her and he loves humans, so he like it better now.

If we talk about really black being, not the dark ones. We can see ones that are not only smart but intelligent, and they are so evolved as white beings. They also take acknowledge with time but they don't have free will, they can only do harm. We couldn't say they ascend to a Lucifer level either because Lucifer is dark arts and have free will, while they don't. Beside he's only leader of a group of beings that are dark arts. There's many more out there. Of course I'm not any kind of specialist in black being but most of the time people fear them and underestimate them, kind of a mistake.

Terror Misu wrote:Don't meant to get off tangent here from Sean's original question but sometimes these discussions head in really fascinating directions and I have to jump on this tangent Plus, it's like... in order to get to Sean's question, we have to backtrack and figure out "What does one mean, how does one define spiritual evolution and ascension?" What I'm finding out is that it isn't as clear cut as it may appear.

Intriguing points, Snakat.

I agree things aren't clear and cut. And everyone probably have a different way to see it. For me none of it is wrong but different way to look at the same thing. For me I like free will, I think doing a "good" thing when having a chance of doing "bad" is more important and count more than when you have no choice.

Snakat, you are extremely intuitive. I am quite aware of the Fallen's plight when Enoch asked God for forgiveness upon their behalf. I am also aware that not all fallen are bad and act in direct interest in educating man for the better. My Entity becomes upset when the subject of his being told to leave & become bound by his Angel parent. I just don't get why such separatism is practiced in heaven. Who am I to question such devine authority? I just don't agree with it at all.

Thanks Ninjamansean This thing about the Fallen Angels bother me to no end, you are right they weren't all bad. Some got cast out for disobeying the rules and doing what they felt right, not because they bring harm of any kind. Some of them really want to educate mankind. Could expand about this of your Angel? Yes, they do have some kind of separatism and I don't agree. To be honest I don't believe in divine authority but I know they are very high in following 'the plan'. To be honest I would love to know who order them, since angels have exist before all this idea of "God" people have today and they are just diverse as demons, some Angels can still have sex with humans and don't get cast out. So I wonder...

For anyone who is interested in knowing how it came to "begin", the entire Universe's existence, from the Void itself. Where the Creator/God/The Holy Spirit, created from nothing to things of existence. The "form" are numerous, too many to be counted, but the "formless" are even more than the "form".

To "help" other beings, of any sort, the only way is to help oneself, by which you then are able to spread what you "know", clair-cognizant, the highest connection that can be made known from the Ancients. A energy healer mentioned that clair-cognizant is the only one clair- that may be devoid of control of Ego, the Absolute knowing, but yet I guess Ego can have some control over it, if you doubt what you receive to be true, the same with other Clairs. All Children of Gods are meant to be "Divine" beings, only when one has achieved this, then one ascend.
Everything started from "The Source", and from there, everything WILL return back to "The Source". The God/Creator/The Holy Spirit knows ALL, for none of his children are able to comprehend the Creator fully. If I may so kindly point out that everyone is making their way back to the Creator, and to do so, everyone has to help themselves to be able to vibrate at that High vibration is the goal, for All in fact.

Often times they move up in rank do to how many people/beings they help. So you can't help them help you. But there are many kind of ranks, like rank in strength, rank in intelligence and actual spiritual rank which sounds like opening one's self to more powers for some, or raising oneself to higher vibrations.

If you, as a human being with limited powers and wisdom have to help them raise in rank, then they didn't deserve it in the first place.