Where is Hitler today?

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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby necromancer » Fri Oct 05, 2012 11:14 pm

Hey Yorick if you get the binding of Hitler let me know. I think he was a very brilliant and complex man.

I personally would like a binding of Benito Mussolini aka Il Duce. My father lived in Sicily while Mussolini was in power. Before Mussolini there was a King who kept everyone poor and stupid but he got kicked out of Italy.Then Mussolini came to power he made a lot of changes for the good of the Italian people. My father is 78 and still talks about what a hero Benito Mussolini was.My father was born with 6 toes on each foot so when he had to go to the hospital to have surgery not only was his hospital bill paid for by the Italian government but he was also received a good part of the wages he would have received he had worked. That is something you don't see in this country unless you are receiving disability or workman's comp.Many other reforms he made including that children had to go to school. Under the King it was optional but Mussolini made it law that children had to go to school.

My father believes that by Mussolini joining with Hitler and Germany it saved the lives of the Italian people. Otherwise had they not joined and had to wait for the Americans by then a good percentage of the Italian people would have been dead.

So in my house we all think of Il Duce Benito Mussolini as a great hero.


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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby angelpaws » Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:36 pm

Yeah I know this is an old topic but I'm so behind on reading the forum. Here's my two cents about Hitler, his personality and how he became such a monster. It all goes back to his childhood and years in WW1. His mother was loving (too loving and smothering some would say) and his father was a drunk who beat his mother and beat Adolph so often that once his mother thought he was dead after a vicious beating. No love lost when his father drank himself to death and died of a heart attack I believe. This made Adolph and his mother even closer. When his mother died in his teens. He was devastated. He wanted to be an artist and tried to get into a Vienna art school ad was turn down. He sold painting of mostly buildings to wealthy Jews to keep from staving to death. From what I understand he didn't hate Jews at this time. (He actually had a huge crush on a Jewish girl named Stefanie, but only from afar she didn't even know she exsisted.) WW1 started and he joined and was a corporal. He job was a dispatcher who ran messages back and forth. Very dangerous job! He had a pet dog named Fuchs that he loved (He loved animals more than people from what I read) He dog disappeared one day and he was heart broken. He suffered from gas being dropped in a bunker and was blind for a short period of time. After the war (and his abusive childhood) he had little to no empathy for human & life more than likely suffered from PTSD and was pissed that the Germans surrendered so fast to the French (as was most of Germany.) Again he was mopping around and was assigned by military to watch subversive groups like National Socialist Workers Party. Instead of reporting back he joined them and because he had a gift of speaking and manipulation & in time became the leader of newly renamed Nazi Party. The Jews were also being blamed for the crushing loss of the Germans in WW1 because people felt that with the money and power the Jewish leaders at the time who didn’t want to continue the war led to the eventual surrender in France. Hitler was being swept up in all the anti Jew sentiment and he knew that ‘hating Jews was a way to get votes.' It didn’t matter that Jews bought his painting when he was starving and that a Jewish officer in WW1 wrote of Hitler’s bravery in running dispatches back and forth under fire resulting in Hitler receiving the Iron Cross. Jews were now considered political pawns in his ever growing sick obsession with power and revenge. So you take a boy with severe emotional issue as a child, have his dreams of being a painter crushed, have his live on the streets, put him in a war (they didn’t have psych evaluations back then for people to join the military especially during war time) Have his witness death, mutilations, gas exposure, etc. By the time he came into power he was a emotional wreck with lack of human compassion. He was a very complex man but I believe if he grew up in a stable environment and wasn’t in WW1 the world would never have heard of Adolph Hitler and 50 million people worldwide (holocaust victims, soldiers from all the armies, civilians) would not have died and the world would be a different place now since countries would have been split up, the US wouldn’t have had WW2 to get the country of the depression as fast either. Israel wouldn’t be the same either since many fled Europe to Israel to escape Hitler. But with all that said. There are always crazed dictators in every generation somewhere and someone else may have rose up and taken Hitler’s place. He was interesting case to study but I don’t think having a spirit of some a emotionally volatile and depressed man around would be a good thing for me. But some people like dealing with people like that and learn from them. It’s a personal thing and if someone wants to get him. Go for it. I hope he can explain a lot to you. I have 3 WW2 German soldiers but these guys were all career soldiers beforeHitler came into power, were stable and they were against the holocaust and the abuse and killing of civilians. Anyway, that’s my view on Hitler. In some ways I felt bad for him but over all I hope he’s rotting where ever he is!


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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Ashino Tsume roshi » Sat Nov 10, 2012 6:22 pm

Hitler was badly abused as a child: Beaten, Locked in a cage; starved. It is more important to go to the root cause of things. In World War 1 he was badly gassed...and spent a long time in a military hospital recovering.

Its ok to blame Hitler for the Concentration Camps, but no one ever mentions the name of Heinrich Himmler and Odilo Golbocnik, and the camp leaders who were directly in charge. Also no one mentions the allies (mandate from Churchill ) trying to (and largely succeeding) of actually spreding typhus near the camps as well. We can blame Hitler for the attacks on Lond's civilians, but why not include the Allies firebombing of Dresden with people running down the street with they, themselves on fire. We can blame Hitler for trying to create an atom bomb, but why not blame the United States for Hiroshima & Nagasaki which killed (using current death estimates - about a total of 450,000 people....the lower estimated were only for immediate death); and we can blame Stalin for a minimum of 40,000,000 deaths in the Ukraine, and we can blame Envar PAsha & others for an estimate ranging form 1.5 million to 12 million people burned alive, and children crucified......Tibet 5 million. The NAtive Americans - who knows?

And the beat goes on. I have 2 points to make:

1, We should blame every person or group who has committed these crimes
'
2. And perhaps we should blame our immediate ancestors for doing nothing about it - before, during, or after....I am still waiting for the Roman Catholic and Lutheran Churches to apologize for the torture murders, hangings, and burnings of approximately 100 million "heretics"..............

As for people like Hitler and Stalin, they were brilliant men gone terribly wrong. Perhaps if they had been brought up with love & understanding...things would have been very different...

But finally, if Mitt Romney and the gang had won, the Republicans would have become responsible for 1% of a population of 380,000,000 people per year starving and not having proper medical treatment - dying....I did not hear one word about this other than my own voice....

The question remains: What responsibility do we have.

ALso, to study Hitler & Stalin is most interesting and I think the lives of Hitler & Stalin are very interesting and should be studied. I briefly met Svetlana Stalin when she lived in Princeton and she said that she really could not understand her father's deepest motivations. As for Hitler, I have 2 things that Htler gave to Eva Braun - A beautiful blue pendant that radiates love and a gold bracelet with a swastika on it made of small rubies with a smaill white diamont at each swastika point and it cleverly opens up to hold a cyanide pill.

The 2 World Wars of the 20th century are incredibly fascinating and we can learn a lot from them and we need to do so. As the Buddhist saint Nicihdatsu Fujii once said to me & others...."KILL NOT LIFE!"

Caiyros


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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Ashino Tsume roshi » Sat Nov 10, 2012 6:32 pm

There is some recent evidence scattered around that Hitler was in South America probably Ecuador. But if he were alive today then he would be 123 some odd years old.....

Note: Some of the earlier posts are very accurate on the history side of things and I have merely added some of my own thoughs & reasoning....

The RUssian claiming that MArtin Bormann was killed during the Bunker bombing - shot I believe...is hogwash...there is overwhelming proof that he was alive in SOuth America and last seen in 1972.

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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby ut0pia » Wed May 01, 2013 1:06 pm

LOL what's the point he speaks german anyway, so you wouldn't understand him, unless you're fluent in german



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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Aurora Magick » Wed May 01, 2013 1:16 pm

I've wondered about this too honestly. I don't support him or hate jewish people or anything. But aside from being insane and murderous he was supposed to have been really smart. He was undoubtedly a great speaker to get his countrymen to go along with his plot. I've considered buying old money from germany that was used in that time, since coins change hands a lot and are excellent energy carriers especially if they've been stored away since their original use, which most would be if they were in a collection. I've not yet had the stones to do it though.

I can definitely understand the knee jerk response but I also think its one of those things where you should learn from history to prevent repeating it. I mean if you got a binding of him, and just asked, honestly, why did you do it? What made you do it? If you could analyze and understand the thought process, warnings for such behavior could be isolated and used to point out those with the potential to turn into harmful individuals in the future.



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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Gryphonista » Wed May 01, 2013 1:18 pm

ut0pia wrote:LOL what's the point he speaks german anyway, so you wouldn't understand him, unless you're fluent in german


Spirit communication transcends language...


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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby gargoyles_path » Tue May 14, 2013 4:19 pm

Anandeswara Rsh wrote:
AS FOR THIS THREAD...I AM NOT TRYINMG TO HOLD ANYONE'S FEET TO THE FIRE, BUT AM SAYING..THAT ON ALL SIDES OF ALL ISSUES - DISCUSSIONS ARE KEY - AND THAT FORCING ANYONE TO BELIEVE ANY CERTAIN THING IS A CRIME...NOTE: TRYING TO CONVINCE AND/OR ARGUING A POINT (ANY POINT) IS FINE...ITS WHEN WE DISPARAGE ANYONE FOR A BELIEF OR IDEA BECAUSE WE THINK IT IS WRONG AND INSTEAD OF DISCUSSION WE "HAMMER" THE OTHER PEOPLE...THEN WE ARE SUPPORTING FASCISM IN THE SAME MANNER AS DOES THE AMERICAN REPUBLICAN PARTY....AND IT IS HURTFUL AND STUPID.

NOTE: I AM NOT COMMENTING ON ANYTHING SAID HERE...I AM SAYING LETS BE CAREFUL NOT TO ENTER INTO WHAT I HAVE MENTIONED.

C-


This, yes, this! I remember when I was young and just learning to write persuasive essays in school, the teacher would say that whether the person reading your argument agrees or not does not matter. What matters is that there is a basis for your argument, and that the reader views your argument as a valid outlook with enough backing for consideration. Teachers don't grade persuasive essays based on whether they themselves agree or not; they read the whole thing, give the argument the benefit of a doubt, and grade it based on how solid the argument is and how much evidence and backing there is to support it. They consider the argument, they don't shut it down when they read the title or the thesis and don't agree with it!

Everyone has different opinions. Everyone has different ideas. Everyone has different interpretations of things.

One example I can think of was how I was discussing with some people about a book. We were discussing new and unpopular ideas about the two main characters, the protagonist and antagonist of the work. We found that there was sufficient evidence that the protagonist's kindness may not have been genuine--at the beginning of the book, he was described as being aloof, watching his sister and her kids out of a sense of duty and not out of love or kindness, grudgingly doing "kind" things because he felt like he had no other choice. Later on, after society has basically screwed him over, he just wants revenge, he steals, he considers killing a nice man...but later on the nice man saves him and only wants one thing for him, and that is for him to live an honest life. Thus, the protagonist feels that it's his duty to do kind things for the sake of what this man did, he'll pay poor people alms just so they won't talk to him and will leave him alone, etc.

As for the antagonist, he's outwardly cold for the sake of his duty, but he has a line saying that "Good God, it's easy to be kind, the hard thing is being just!" suggesting that, unlike the protagonist, he's naturally kind, but he's outwardly cold for the sake of duty. And what makes him even more opposite of the protagonist, is that: he's naturally kind, he's outwardly cold, just, and dutiful, but he does this because he believes this is the greater kindness. Whereas the protagonist is: naturally aloof and dutiful, and outwardly kind for the sake of his duty to the nice man he once met. On top of this, the antagonist is described as having a heart of wood, which suggests it was a tender green shoot when he was younger, but hardened over time to protect itself, and it bears fruits that nobody thanks him for.

Well, some people saw/heard what we were saying, and they did not like this. At all. It's an unpopular opinion basically to view this protagonist as anything other than a genuine saint I suppose (and we weren't even insulting him, we like him, everyone has flaws anyway), and the antagonist is pretty unpopular (which blows my mind since, despite his flaws, he's not a bad person and does some really heroic things, and the poor guy had a bad childhood and he's not the most sane man ever, he has a breakdown early on in the book), so these people were hounding and shaming us for saying that the protagonist's kindness wasn't genuine, and they started saying we said things we never did, like that we were claiming the antagonist was better and that he was morally superior, etc, and they said it's laughable and completely shut us down (and they weren't even in the conversation). So it was unnecessary shaming, coming from the fact that they did not like what we had to say and refused to open up to that possibility. We were just discussing ideas and coming up with interpretations based on textual evidence, we were open to new ideas, we didn't even necessarily 100% believe this interpretation yet (I'm more convinced of it now though, and so are they, but that's besides the point), but they shut the ideas down with no good argument and shamed us because they simply didn't like what we had to say. They didn't even acknowledge the textual backing.

I know that this is just an example in fiction, but I think how people react to fiction and ideas about fiction can show how they may act in reality. After all, if somebody shuts down and rudely makes fun of an interpretation about fiction simply because "they don't like it," how do you think they will react to a person's argument in real life? What if a person is trying to defend himself or herself to that person, or a person is giving that person constructive criticism? That person who reacts that way to an idea about fiction, will probably shut down an idea in real life and shame the person who came up with it simply because he or she "does not like it." And this is severely limiting to a person's mind and learning ability, to not be open to ideas you never thought of, to not give those ideas a benefit of a doubt, to not let yourself be convinced of something you don't already believe in. For all you know, you could be convinced otherwise and become more enlightened if you're more open to ideas!

I'm really sorry about this long tangent. This could kind of be brought around to the topic of Hitler, of accepting people who look up to him in a way, without looking down on them or accusing them of being prejudiced (because it most certainly does not mean they are prejudiced), to accepting his good qualities and that they are in fact good, to accepting the fact that you can actually learn good things from him. That's not to say he didn't do heinous things of course; you should be open to the bad as well as the good.


RaeNebula wrote:Every human who has ever lived has both negative and positive qualities. I think there may be a line when a person goes too far in a negative direction. Initiating mass genocide most definitely qualifies in my book.


Yes, I agree, I believe there is a line that, when crossed, there is absolutely no forgiveness. "Past the point of no return." It takes a lot to reach it in my book, but I think it exists, it's when the bad outnumbers the good. The good doesn't even make up for it. The crimes committed have no recompense, or else the price of recompense is very, very high. People shouldn't be able to make innocent people suffer such horrors without any punishment.

Cheese Sandwitch wrote:Probably deserved?? the man is responsible for the torture death and almost genocide of an entire generation of people (MILLIONS) he felt he was better than. He was evil epitomized. he had so much blood on his hands and by the end of it, he took the cowards way out- suicide- rather than face what hed done. I for one hope he is being plagued by every BA entity in the hereafter and i hope each and every soul whos death he was responsible for is given the opportunity to kick him in his ghosty nads.


He definitely does deserve it in my book. Although, he's not the ONLY one responsible for those crimes. After all, he wouldn't have been able to do it without the help of countless other people who were on his side. Hitler could rightly be seen as the mastermind behind everything, the face and the head so to speak, but the blame I think should be spread to all the people working on his side as well. The ones who were aware of what was going on anyway. I suppose some people were more to blame than others, but what I'm trying to say is that Hitler didn't do what he did singlehandedly, other people were just as guilty, such as his close circle (Himmler, etc), the SS and Gestapo, the people who did the dirty work for Hitler and his circle and other "higher-ups"...If Hitler were the only guilty one he would have gotten nowhere.

Only focusing on him and only blaming him is like only focusing on the President and blaming everything on the President in my opinion. I don't excuse any of his actions however; yes, his past was sad, yes, he had psychological issues, yes, he had good qualities and wasn't entirely evil personally, but he still ultimately had a choice, and he chose evil and to commit such heinous crimes and horrors against countless innocent people. And those crimes outweigh the good by a long shot in my opinion.

At least everyone has the opportunity to learn from his wrongs, however.

Gryphonista wrote:
ut0pia wrote:LOL what's the point he speaks german anyway, so you wouldn't understand him, unless you're fluent in german


Spirit communication transcends language...


^ This

^^ ::facepalm::



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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Chouki » Tue Nov 29, 2016 10:08 pm

It is a very old thread, but i wanted to add my thoughts.

Hitler himself was not the true culprit, but he was the perfect image of it.

Superpowers always looks for someone in who people can believe in, so they can stay hide in the shadows and they can manipulate the strings of the history without been ever known.

In France Coca-Cola or Apple have way more power then the president to do anything they want, but simple minded people think they have voted for the good guy, or that the President will change their lives...

Controlling the masses are the point here, and Hitler was not more then a marionette in some very dark complot.

The problem with him, is that he have choose to accept this role, making him the biggest hated known dictator in the history of mankind, but he was not the one who would switch on the gas in every concentration camp, nor he was always around when torture was the "way to go"

he took part in a disgusting system of fear and death, for whatever reason, and he can have only that at his charge, but , what about the other responsible super powerful people?

They have engage millions and have nearly arrived to erased a entire ethnicity from this earth, and that in our modern days!!!

Was German people ok with that? i don't think so, you know how dictatorship works: " you don't want it? i will kill all of your children = "ok i will shut my mouth"

I will never defends this bastard as i think absolutely everyone can choose his own path. Even if he was abused and hurt as a child, lots of people where too, they did not became serial killers , and have not committed any mass genocide or became haters of everything!

Binding Hitler for knowledge purposes? why not...Admiring him? Oooook, i am out!!!

Had him a brilliant mind? ho <<Removed by Mod>> god yes, can brilliant minds turn wrong? ho <<Removed by Mod>> god yeas!!!



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Re: Where is Hitler today?

Postby Aurum » Wed Nov 30, 2016 5:24 pm

Hitler is always use as an example of the worst kind of human being but I think Stalin was equally bad, perhaps even worse.




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