so i have rules in place and i know that DA will push boundaries and rules sometimes, i also know that you should trust your spirits in why they do things though, i have a few DA lately that have been pushing boundaries, they say they dont really like how i have my rules set up, right now i have it set to where i will give a warning and then if they continue after that i will use the punishment i have set in place for breaking that rule, they say they want me to be more lenient and not do things this way though, they say they want me to use “kinder” methods, like just talking, but i think that if they know what the cuase and affect to a rule is and still do it, then i should stick to my word, i do agree in talking things out in certian situations of course, but they say i shouldnt use punishments at all unless somebody just goes way to far, i have mixed feelings about this.

Have you tried talking to them? Could it be they think you misunderstood what happened? Or might they behave better if things were agreed more clearly in advance?

On the other hand, ASH does recommend applying consequences if rules are actually broken. Otherwise there's no point to having rules. See https://shop.creepyhollows.com/spirit-k ... spell.html

But don't forget - they're bound companions and will usually comply to a large extent. But its not pleasant for them if they didn't actually do what we accuse them of, of course.

I agree with Lewk; establish consequences for breaking rules, and enforce them immediately when rules are broken

I’d also suggest being certain the punishment fits the crime. Personally I have less to more severe consequences, depending on which rule is broken.

For example, petting my cat (who doesn’t like being touched by foreign energy) invokes a punishment of forbidding them to be in the same room as my cat for a day… not banishing them to their vessel and not speaking to them for 3 days. They make my cat uncomfortable, well then, they’ll be uncomfortable for a day. The punishment is appropriate to the action.

But always enforce consequences as soon as possible. Otherwise there’s no point in having rules!

I don’t really handle punishment in my keep, I have leaders which manage each subsection and a main leader for everyone (spirits, beings, etcs) every time a new friend enters my circle (being or spirit) he has a chat with them and lays down the laws, punishments and guidelines. He also tells them the process for when I might be in danger who to contact and what to do based on the threat.

Although occasionally I handle things on my own, it’s more so I don’t believe they deserve such a harsh punishment and ask them to do something for me instead to show they are sorry. I believe chatting, conversing and spending time with DAs which seem to be problem starters are the best way to solve these issues. Sometimes humans missunderstand beings or spirits intentions, especially races with different cultures to ours. Sometimes we need to ask our selves not what we should do to punish them, but what should we do to understand them so this issue doesn’t happen again. Anyway I hope this helps, have a nicu day!

I’m probably not the best person to ask as the more I read these forums I feel I spirit keep the wrong way. I’ve honestly never had to punish anybody in my keep for bad behavior but I’ve really only have 2 rules. Those 2 rules are really big for me and my family knows it and so respects them.

pokemonsavage wrote: ↑Tue Mar 07, 2023 9:10 am so i have rules in place and i know that DA will push boundaries and rules sometimes, i also know that you should trust your spirits in why they do things though, i have a few DA lately that have been pushing boundaries, they say they dont really like how i have my rules set up, right now i have it set to where i will give a warning and then if they continue after that i will use the punishment i have set in place for breaking that rule, they say they want me to be more lenient and not do things this way though, they say they want me to use “kinder” methods, like just talking, but i think that if they know what the cuase and affect to a rule is and still do it, then i should stick to my word, i do agree in talking things out in certian situations of course, but they say i shouldnt use punishments at all unless somebody just goes way to far, i have mixed feelings about this.

I think it's an incorrect mindset to assume that all DA beings will push boundaries, break rules, or do ABCD things wrong. They have their reasons for acting the way they do and want you to learn something from it. It's better to talk things out instead of punishing a friend with bad behavior like some kind of pet. They're friends after all.

I have a 6-page document of house rules that I add to as the need arises, spanning from house rules to my needs and desires for them to be, and me to be. It works both ways for us to live happily ever after in Earthen Realm and the others if we work together.
But I don't view them as "rules"—just what I feel comfortable working with and a list that changes according to my Keep and me. It grows with us.
Most often, my WA entities and spirits break the "rules" instead. Lol.

To each his or her own, I have my own way with my Keep and you have yours. I'm not saying one way is right and the other is wrong. But if every being in your Keep keeps popping up the same question and purposely breaks the rules, you need to change your method. Communication is the key to understanding and maintaining relationships.

My biggest punishment so far was a repeated house rule with firm voice and an offering to my black dragon, due to his energy. I firmly asked him to regulate himself better, because I couldn't bare him near & dear next to my bed. And placed his vessel outside of my home, into my car for him to cave in for a week. He absolutely loved it. We travelled to work together everyday and chat without issues but no way to sleep with him in one room.

Then, few weeks on he suddenly came "good". My leaders, took care of this business. I never had other issues ever with him or anyone.... Or maybe my Gregory watcher was a bit intimidating with requests that was against house rules but we talked it over on a firm tone of voice on my part.

My Bannik was also extremely strong in her first week. I simply ask them to tone it down, please during the day, and I told them about my needs to have a good night sleep....from time to time. We use cards now to work together and channel messages during day time & I sleep like a baby.

I believe, I need to understand my spirits first and get to knowing them how they behave, before I ever would go out of my ways to fully punish them. I don't have punishment methods at all other then what Ash recommendations to subdue as a last result. I totally not want to offend them at all, incase I miss understood them.

I like to get down to business and work out a better solution with each of them first. If ever something WOULD become a real issue one day, I would use the portal and send them over to Ash to hang out with & his companions with an attached letter explaining the situation and needed help for my spirit.

In 14 years of 'keeping', I've never had a spirit companion break my one rule - which is mutual respect. That one rule means we respect one another's ways, wishes, individuality and intelligence.
I can't imagine what it is like to maintain an actual list of rules and still have spirits break them multiple times. If that is happening to you, it suggests constant disrespect, or that you have poorly thought-out rules, too many rules, or that there is a misunderstanding.

How do we deal with mentors, friends, family, lovers, acquaintances when they cross boundaries? That's what you may want to contemplate as at least a base for how the spirits are approached.

I think most of the time this happens it has got to be a misunderstanding, and occasionally you have an oddly matched companion. It could be that you don't know at all what you're getting yourself into with a specific race of being. A bit more of the responsibility, in any case, has to be placed on the keeper.

As a reminder - you need to be able to coexist with the spirit, and they with you. There will need to be compromise.
You can't have a spirit companion come in and expect to be able to have everything precisely your way, all of the time. If you go into keeping thinking that, seems quite misguided. Obviously I cannot speak for everyone, it ultimately depends on what is most important to you of the bond.

If you cannot clearly communicate with your spirits then you don't know they are breaking boundaries intentionally - so why would you 'punish' them (questionable way to put it, by the way)? And if you can clearly communicate, you should be doing just that to know how to resolve this between you instead of relying on outsiders to the situation for advice.

Vipera aspis atra wrote: ↑Wed Mar 08, 2023 6:47 am In 14 years of 'keeping', I've never had a spirit companion break my one rule - which is mutual respect. That one rule means we respect one another's ways, wishes, individuality and intelligence.
I can't imagine what it is like to maintain an actual list of rules and still have spirits break them multiple times. If that is happening to you, it suggests constant disrespect, or that you have poorly thought-out rules, too many rules, or that there is a misunderstanding.

How do we deal with mentors, friends, family, lovers, acquaintances when they cross boundaries? That's what you may want to contemplate as at least a base for how the spirits are approached.

I think most of the time this happens it has got to be a misunderstanding, and occasionally you have an oddly matched companion. It could be that you don't know at all what you're getting yourself into with a specific race of being. A bit more of the responsibility, in any case, has to be placed on the keeper.

As a reminder - you need to be able to coexist with the spirit, and they with you. There will need to be compromise.
You can't have a spirit companion come in and expect to be able to have everything precisely your way, all of the time. If you go into keeping thinking that, seems quite misguided. Obviously I cannot speak for everyone, it ultimately depends on what is most important to you of the bond.

If you cannot clearly communicate with your spirits then you don't know they are breaking boundaries intentionally - so why would you 'punish' them (questionable way to put it, by the way)? And if you can clearly communicate, you should be doing just that to know how to resolve this between you instead of relying on outsiders to the situation for advice.

Thank you for sharing this as I was beginning to think I am spirit keeping the wrong way after reading a lot of posts here. It seems we have very similar philosophies on this journey. I tell all my new friends coming in that my own house rules are mutual respect and free will. I’ve honestly never had any issues with those rules being broken or felt the need to punish anyone ever. I honestly abhor the idea of having to punish anyone also. I feel that having the rule in place as is keeps us all in line including myself. My own nature would make me act out if someone gave me a bunch of arbitrary rules to be honest and I just can’t bring myself to try putting those same kind of rules on those around me.

@Osean

Right on. I don't think there's a wrong way to go about this path, we have to find the way for us and maybe for you and I it makes more sense to do things this way.

At the same time, I wonder how many here have experimented and figured out what truly works or makes sense - and I think that ought to be encouraged, along with just looking at these bonds with that optimal goal of mutual respect. Or understanding how differences are meant to bring expansion.

When I bring otherworldly companions into my life, I want for them to offer ways or perspectives that complement my own but also those that will better my own journey - and those can challenge us or challenge our boundaries, naturally. I think that if rules are so restrictive as to disallow that experience of a new culture (the culture of the beings we have invited into our lives), it largely defeats the purpose - as well as benefit - of spirit keeping.

That doesn't mean we don't have a say in what is experienced, what happens or why, or that conflict cannot arise.. but it is so much like any companionship. You know and understand your boundaries, but if you invite in a spirit of a certain quality that you know may lead to reassessment of those boundaries - it is presumed you do so because you are cool with potential expansion or change of where you're at.

And instances where boundaries are overstepped that cause harm, I would not at all expect of a spirit or being whom you both: a.) understand and were prepared to invite into your life, and b.) are properly matched with.

Punishment.. I'd never 'punish'. If I had to 'punish' it would mean that is not a friend but someone I am seeking justice upon.. so where are you really at, then? But that extends the question to - are these spirits our friends, or are they here to play out a specific role --and are they fully aware of and willing to play out that role? Have we mutually agreed on terms?
It seems to me where rules are 'broken' there wasn't a proper agreement or understanding to begin with.

I don't think I am just lucky in that I've never had real problems. Before I was formally keeping, and still, I've had unbounds around me all of my life and have been able to manage based on establishing an understanding. Those you cannot establish an understanding with, maybe they aren't meant to be around or in most severe cases must be banished. You don't expect that with reputable bindings though. I really think the most you should anticipate is misunderstanding.. which can be fixed by further investment in communication.

Enough with my ramble; wanted to elaborate in the case that this dialogue may be welcome contemplation.