Planning to get a second opinion on if I have Spirits

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Inedible
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This last book was the best one I have ever gotten my hands on. It combines Buddhist tradition with results from current research into the mind and brain. That's why I couldn't have read it twenty or thirty years ago. As I said, it has guided me through patches that have caused me to quit more times than I can count. Right now it is helping with problems I haven't gotten to before. This is why I don't want to mess with it. I need a few more months to stabilize things. Results are coming now. It is amazing. I am literally happier than I have ever been before. And my friend who is working the book with me also likes it most after reading so many others we can't say. You know how it is with these things - find someone you trust to verify your results.


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Charles_Odinforce wrote: I would put my spirits on tasks, REASONABLE tasks, remembering that all magick is constrained to the altering of probabilities (in a greater or lesser degree) and that even magickal beings are held to those limits.
Back when I first went to college in 1993 I met someone who had been attuned to Reiki. She didn't know a thing about it, really, beyond that she put her hands on someone and would let some energy flow. It didn't come from her and didn't drain her in the process. I'm not sure what year it was when I attended a Reiki demonstration in a book store by a Reiki Master and was chosen to receive a sample of the energy. She put her hands on my head and I felt the energy moving down to my stomach. I had been having trouble with the food at school and the well water of the city. The energy was clearly solid and real and I was able to grab hold of it mentally and send it back up. This convinced me to pay to be attuned to the master level over the course of 1998 and going into 1999. At that point, I started working with connecting with people at a distance and sending energy to them. Often it was necessary to get information about people so I started with a general person outline and waited for it to fill in with the details. It was as easy as letting go of control just a little. When I send energy to someone, I look at the way it feels like it is flowing. Sometimes it goes smoothly and just speeds up and slows down in cycles. Sometimes it builds up around me and I know it isn't being accepted. Other times it builds up around the person I am sending to and I accept that it will be received another time. Sometimes plans change and the person I am sending to isn't available at the scheduled time. It was 2002 when I really started collecting attunements at a distance and it was unusual to feel anything from them. But I would receive them to the best of my ability and then do self attunements afterward to strengthen the feel of the energy for when I would use it later. All I really needed to work with was a name on my end and someone on the other side who had some intent to allow me to connect. I did it many times with great success regardless of how tense I was and with no prep work. It only took a few seconds of connection if I just wanted to feel some energy exchange. A tough connection might take enough time to breathe in and out ten times. So how can it be so easy with random people around the world and so hard with a Succubus that I paid CH for who is supposed to be directly bound to my Spirit without even a vessel to separate us? Sometimes I send energy to someone and it is like running on ice. I just can't get any traction or any sense that someone is out there. This is how it has always been with my CH Spirits. When it happens with a person, it usually means that I don't have permission to connect. Like when one person is asking me to work on a third party. Buying custom conjures should avoid this issue because they were in on choosing to bond with me.

So that is the reasonable task. I want a sense of connection. Not all the time, but from time to time. The beginning of an exchange of energy and information.

My current progress with meditation is making a big difference. I expect that in a few months I will be able to use it as the basis for developing a variety of other skills. For now, though, my gut sense is to keep it simple.


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Charles_Odinforce
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You are...: a practitioner
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 105
Spelled Number: 18
Your favorite spirit to work with: Aesir
If I could be anything, I would be...: Dragon
My super power would be...: Laser-beam eyes
My magical/paranormal name...: Thorian

The next thing I'd ask is, how much time do you set aside for that connection? What I mean is, sitting in a receptive state without much else going on?

The reason I ask that is, outside of a receptive state you may be more attuned (pun intended) more toward energies that predominantly reside in this realm. Reiki is a very physical energy, similar to Qi. Most people who have strong spirit senses also focus a lot of time on astral projection, not physical energy work. I'm a proponent that both sets of skills are needed.

You said sometimes you send energy to someone and don't get a feeling of any traction. Have you tried doing Reiki on various spirits and seeing what results you would get from that? It may strengthen your connection to them. If there are blockages likewise Reiki may overcome them.

Reiki is an engaged artform when it is in use, you may be holding space, but in holding space it's like holding a set of very gentle doors open, your hands are still on those doors. My thought on this is doing Reiki on the spirits uses a set of doors you are familiar with for working with a set you may have less a connection to?

For my part, most of what I do is in journey or a semi-state of trance. I only get pinged when emergencies are up, partially because that is my preference, partially because I learned to keep the division more solid for purposes of preventing illusion methods on my own mind. That gets into more of the minutia of my own training, but my point is you may NEED to practice something like Shamanic Journey to make a stronger connection. If you don't though, I'd still be interested to see the results you get from practicing Reiki on your spirits. You sound to have a large collection of them, so you should have many to practice with. I'd be surprised if you had an "ice traction reaction" on every single one, but I'm more than willing to wait and see what the results are. The Reiki suggestion isn't the end all be all, but it is the one I'm making right now.

You mentioned also in 2002 that you wouldn't always receive attunements easily and would need to self attune. That too to me suggests perhaps a limited range of energy sense focusing more on "life force" oriented energy. Not uncommon among many practitioners mind you.

So on a side note, have you done anything like vision questing or seeking your spirit guides? Have you had success in those areas?


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You are...: in the learning process
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 35
Spelled Number: 40
Your favorite spirit to work with: Demons
If I could be anything, I would be...: Human. :)
My super power would be...: See spirits in true form

This conversation is beginning to make a lot more sense at this point. I'm very interested how all this will work out. I think Charles makes some very good points about using a physical energy to work with spiritual energy. Could definitely be some of the reason you feel like the spirits aren't there. Could just be that their energy is very mystical / ethereal / close to death (they are spirits after all) and not like working Reiki with another living being. I can't make any suggestions but this seems somewhat plausible as a source of confusion for you. You work Reiki in the physical realm and the spirits are in the spiritual. As Charles suggests perhaps there is a needed evolution to expand your ability to the spiritual.


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You are...: in the learning process
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 35
Spelled Number: 40
Your favorite spirit to work with: Demons
If I could be anything, I would be...: Human. :)
My super power would be...: See spirits in true form

I just want to add I'm learning a lot from your discussion here. There are actually some good insights coming out of this.


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Your favorite spirit to work with: Those in my keep ❤
If I could be anything, I would be...: Me
My super power would be...: Ability to fly
My magical/paranormal name...: ESL80
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This is interesting and I'm learning as well.


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Inedible, you've been around a long time, and for as long as I can remember you have repeatedly said you have difficulty with the paranormal. I applaud you for your continued devotion & diligence to making this journey work for you, but there's no doubt you are soured on the fact that you aren't have the experiences and interactions that others are having. No one can deny you the right of frustration, but I caution you against throwing accusations against CH or other conjurers because you aren't having the level of interaction you wish for.

Everyone here wants you to be successful. We all want to see you succeed in this journey and be happy. 1s <3

There have been many, ourselves included, who have offered you advice, support, and guidance over your time here. No one can deny that you have been persistent and committed to making this path work for you, but don't take that frustration out on others :(
I can ask my Spirits to help by standing up and being counted if they don't want to be ignored after being counted as a false negative.
That's their right and their choice. They don't have to stand up and be recognized by your teacher if they don't want to. You cannot rob them of their free will because you want to put them on the spot and demand they reveal themselves to someone. Maybe they all will, maybe some will, maybe none of them will. They have to make the decision and as a Keeper you have to respect their rights.

There isn't anything nefarious to why spirit readings are not recommended, it's common sense. The sole reason we recommend against Spirit Readings is NOT because we worry about our own work, but because other unscrupulous sellers in the Spirit Keeping community have used it as a tool to bash competitors and then sell the person their conjurations. That's the plain & simple reason. I know you've been around a long time, so I know you've seen the aftermath threads from situations like that. So please don't make it sound like CH advises against it because of us specifically. It is for the safeguard of anyone who doesn't want a bait & switch situation. This community is about protecting the Spirit Keeping community, we have enough enemies beyond these borders that we should all be looking out for one another. So when rampant scams surfaced related to spirit readings, it was common sense to recommend against them.

Not to mention, the fact that your spirits don't want to be under the microscope. Whether they are from us or anyone else, they aren't there to prove themselves to you by communicating with someone else. They didn't choose to be the companion of a stranger & share themselves with an outsider, they chose to be with you. They trust you to do your part as much as you trust them to do their part.

How about asking the teacher to conjure and bind a spirit for you?
Or at least asking the teacher to let his/her spirits to be sensed by you?
In this case, you have personal relationship with the teacher and he/she can personally guide you in connecting and sensing the spirit.
This is by far & wide the best recommendation. If you trust this teacher so much, they should be able to conjure a spirit for you that you can see, sense, and feel. Instead of judging the work of others to be real or fake. If you can feel the spirit from your teacher, then that's a good place to learn and start overall with your Spirit Keeping journey. If you don't feel the spirit from your teacher, then you may want to make a decision from that point forward about how much time you want to put into this journey overall.
There are countless topics here that indicate CH indeed are quite adept conjurers and yes they mass sell, but why is that a problem? That is how they do business, there are other sellers here who I will not forget, who do not mass sell their spirits, yet have no release clauses and instead charge you $50 to release their spirits. Is that the sign of a better conjurer? I don't think so. If I was allowed, I would name and shame that conjurer, I think it's despicable. Mass conjurering though I think is not. It is just business, and CH does try their best to ensure their bindings are good for the people they are selling to, so the reasoning that they have too many layers of protection well, it does not make sense to me. They bridge their spirits also, which allows even further for better communication.
It's easy to forget that we didn't start with a site anywhere near this size. It was tiny, just a handful of pages and a tiny Forum with 10 people. The reason we are the size we are is because people trust our work & people know that we actually care about what we put out into the lives of others. We treat spirits & entities with respect, with honor, and we give them the freedom to make choices when it comes to Keepers.

No website goes from being a tiny blip in the abyss of the internet to the largest of its genre because there isn't a mutual and profound trust. That's undeniable.
I am almost positive that their best work goes into their marketing and we as customers do all the heavy lifting ourselves to make it work.
Isn’t that every purchase, though? Suppose you buy a car. The car dealer is not going to provide you with driving lessons, pay for your gas and car insurance, and drive you around. Once you buy the car, the onus is on you to get/renew your license, pay car-related costs, and drive the car yourself.

Instead of having the teacher do a reading, how about having them teach you how to sense and communicate with spirits? That’s what teachers are for, and it’ll get you moving toward a goal you actually want to achieve.
We already do far more work than traditional conjurers with the bindings. You don't have to recite invocations and perform rituals to work with your spirit companions. We do a lot of the heavy lifting before you even get the binding! I think some education and background on what you're talking about would help you immensely understand what you're judging.

There will never be a point in time with magic or spirits where you as the responsible party, will not have heavy lifting. This is a spiritual path, a spiritual belief, there isn't a miracle that's going to come down and anoint you with the ability to do everything within the supernatural, that has to be earned.

It's your responsibility to bond with your spirits, they are in your care. It's your responsibility to work with spells and bindings to excise their magical gifts.

You have to be an active participant in your journey, otherwise what's the point? This is a belief path, this is a spiritual path, this isn't a community of people looking for miracle cures & we all expect that everything will fall into our laps because we simply bought a binding. You have to be part of what you live or there isn't any reward.


I know it's very easy to play the blame game when you read threads about others having experiences, and it's easier to tell everyone else that it's not real than it is to admit that it's not working for you, but there's no justification for trying to rob other people of their validity of their experiences and their happiness in order to act as a balm for your sore feelings.

I completely understand why you are frustrated and upset, and I know that over the years there have been many people here who have offered you support, ideas, compassion, love, and advice. We are still more than happy to help you & guide you, but don't discredit the members here because you are upset. It's incredibly insulting to say that just because it's not working for you that CH isn't real and everyone here is invalidated, and that just wraps it in a tidy bundle of denial.

If it doesn't work for you then it doesn't work, but just because I'm not successful in learning to play the guitar doesn't mean music doesn't exist and all the music companies are just great marketers who are selling people guitars that can't be played. No matter what you do in life, you are an integral and important part of the process. You have to put the time and work in no matter what. Someone else might be a guitar prodigy, while I might finally learn and limp along, but my bad experience doesn't immediately invalidate the whole of something that exists.

I also think if your teacher is highly regarded in your eyes then you should be judging their work first and see if you can feel their spirit conjurations before you tell them to be judge any other practitioner. We don't do it for other sellers, ever, because it's an unethical line to cross. It has nothing to do with whether or not we believe in the power or work of other sellers, it's because it is unethical to pass any form of judgment, good or bad. We would rather be neutral and let the people decide for themselves rather than us being the deciding factor on who's real and who's not. That is a responsibility & liability we would not open ourselves to.

It's never easy seeing someone who has the level of difficulty you do try to work through it over & over, and for so long. I really hope that you find some peace, either in learning to work with this path, or leaving the path if you feel it's too cumbersome. We're all here to help you, we're all here to offer continued advice & support, and we hope you find what you're looking for <3


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You are...: new to this
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 0
Spelled Number: 0
Your favorite spirit to work with: PeiNgoTorTorCheen
If I could be anything, I would be...: me
My super power would be...: Ability to shape-shift
My magical/paranormal name...: TiuLengLui

I'm with you all the way, Inedible. Many of the "experiences" posted here are from delusional people, and are to be discounted. Many of them are actually kids.

This does not include the true gurus like Charles Odinforce, of course.


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You are...: in the learning process
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Spelled Number: 200
Your favorite spirit to work with: All of them
If I could be anything, I would be...: Endless
My super power would be...: Ability to shape-shift

niceprotonman wrote:I'm with you all the way, Inedible. Many of the "experiences" posted here are from delusional people, and are to be discounted. Many of them are actually kids.
You can't really say that. Neither do you know them nor their circumstances nor are you a professional psychologist or practitioner who could actually determine anything of that, especially not over the internet.

I would have at least used an imho or said it's an opinion. Stating it as a fact like you did is wrong and can be seen as offensive and inflammatory


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You are...: a master
Number of Spirits: 10000
Spelled Number: 10000
Your favorite spirit to work with: Dragons
My super power would be...: Ability to shape-shift

As we know many of the members here from our shop, I can tell you that "many" are not kids.

There may be some kids here, but most members, especially Tenured and above, are grown adults. You shouldn't make assumptions about age. You are new here and you don't know members here well enough to make that statement. If you want to be welcome by a community, you should be kind to your fellow members.

As to experiences, as already stated, you cannot make a clinical diagnosis from posts without any knowledge of the person and background. You are not a medical professional.

Not to mention, as I've already expressed, it is a terrible thing to discredit someone else out of discrimination.


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