For me, the problem isn't that I don't interact with spirits so much as that it doesn't happen on a conscious level. I've never been very social and don't even know what people talk about, let alone what I would say to a spirit, so it happens on a completely different level.

I feel the flow and connection of the energy, but it's like that scene from the movie Close Encounters where the computers are clearly having a conversation with the alien mother-ship, but the people have no idea what they're saying to each other
A clip for those who haven't seen the movie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4PYI6TzqYk

It gets frustrating at times, but I just keep working with what I have to work with

Dragonoake wrote:For me, the problem isn't that I don't interact with spirits so much as that it doesn't happen on a conscious level. I've never been very social and don't even know what people talk about, let alone what I would say to a spirit, so it happens on a completely different level.

I feel the flow and connection of the energy, but it's like that scene from the movie Close Encounters where the computers are clearly having a conversation with the alien mother-ship, but the people have no idea what they're saying to each other
A clip for those who haven't seen the movie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4PYI6TzqYk

It gets frustrating at times, but I just keep working with what I have to work with

This is exactly how it is with me too. I connect with spirits easily and I feel them but communication happens on a different level and it is greatly frustrating.

I keep thinking about what Charles said about a candle flame always being in motion...
Plus, it's a focal point and an energy source
Could well be worth a try

Oh, I'm well aware of how Reiki works, but everyone experiences that process differently, so I had to ask.

Also, the idea that "Reiki has to have somewhere to go" is a misnomer. Reiki can be done on an area as well, this tells me a lot more about how your mind/subconscious works than Reiki itself. A person can simply DO Reiki without a target, and there are meditations in most manuals for Reiki training that work in a fashion as I describe. However, that feeling of a target would be a different kind of feedback. The fact you can feel one kind of feedback and not the other means that for you, the world is locked into physical manifestations in this plane. At least so far as I can tell. That said more experiments are needed to determine that. Things like doing Reiki for a deceased loved one would be what comes next.

As for the hands not getting hot, that's a strange thing to have stopped. The best I've met have always had hot hands. Heck, when I was a Reiki Level 1 the person who taught me was shocked because I displayed "The heat of a level 3" and she'd only seen one person up to that point do that. It was other energy work techniques I was practicing mixing in with the Reiki of course, but I've learned to use that as a physical gauge of Reiki. It may be you need to consider being attuned again or doing the practice exercises and meditations found in it. No judgment is meant in that statement, but if you've moved to a point where your hands aren't going hot during practice, we can't be sure you are using full reiki at this point

The speeding up and slowing down are a part of the process though, but not always, and not for all people. For the vast majority I know they feel not a sense of "flow" but a sense of "pull" to where the Reiki needs to go. This is not meant as a criticism, just to show you that yours is a unique case with what you are describing to me, therefore I'm using methods that are unique to try and help.

"My Spirits - if they are really out there - are going to have to accept that I need help from somewhere. And the more I talk with people here about it the more frustrated and not heard (or understood) I tend to feel. It just winds me up more. It would be a relief if I had someone who could consistently act as a mediator, but that doesn't seem to be possible." - This here though I need to hit on a bit. I want to turn the tables around, and I want to remind you of this. They are not dogs, they are not robots, they have emotions, needs, and wants. So I'm going to put you in their shoes. The following is meant not as a criticism, but as an example of how you said that, and to show you how they might take it.

"Inedible, if he really is training at all, is going to have to accept that some people grow at a different rate. The more I see him post the more frustrated I become by his lack of focus, and it seems like he's not hearing the advice being given him or doesn't choose to understand it at all. It just winds me up, it would be a relief if he would just listen to someone when they post."

Now, I'm not saying those things, directly or indirectly. I'm using an example of how much power words can have when written a certain way. These spirits I assure you can read, and if I were them reading what you wrote, I'd feel probably how you will feel when you read that paragraph. It's all in the intent though, I wrote that paragraph as if I was accusing to prove a point. Let me word that differently to show the emotional impact.

"Ultimately some people grow at different rates. I'm as frustrated as Inedible is by how things are going, and how hard this seems to be for him. While I know he's listening, I wish I could reach him more, and feel like my own words aren't enough sometimes. It will be a great relief when things DO begin to click."

Part of your method of wording also has a negative connotation to it. When one works in negatives, the empower the negative. If your focus includes more doubt than a suspension of disblief, the only result you can get is to be let down.

On the candle: Take your time, trust me my workload is massive over here so I have time to wait. I will say if that is how all types of training are, and its weeks between efforts, it may be a kind of wasted thing. These arts take dedication and focus. Hours upon hours, especially for those who have any kind of emotional, psychological, or spiritual blockages. If you can't put the time in, it may, in fact, be better for you to consider a different area to direct your day to day energies. I'll never tell you to give up, but i will say that if you can't put in an hour a day, every day, 3 to 4 times a week, that isn't really practice then. If you were boxing, playing the violin, or learning computer repair I'd say the same.

"Things are moving forward now. I don't know where they are going, but I feel like I am getting close. It turns out I know a second person in person who not only has lucid dreams but also has experienced lucid NREM sleep. He told me about a time when the dream ended and he found himself floating in light until another dream started. It has been several years, but I remember floating in a gold light. It felt like everything was perfect and nothing could harm me. I didn't need or want anything else, and it felt like time didn't exist. It was the happiest I could ever remember being. Too bad it didn't last. It is still a goal of mine to experience deep dreamless sleep consciously every night."

THAT is excellent, and it may be you need that mid point between mental states to make connections. What practices are you doing toward lucid dream work? Have you attempted out of body projection yet?

Charles_Odinforce wrote:On the candle: Take your time, trust me my workload is massive over here so I have time to wait. I will say if that is how all types of training are, and its weeks between efforts, it may be a kind of wasted thing. These arts take dedication and focus. Hours upon hours, especially for those who have any kind of emotional, psychological, or spiritual blockages. If you can't put the time in, it may, in fact, be better for you to consider a different area to direct your day to day energies. I'll never tell you to give up, but i will say that if you can't put in an hour a day, every day, 3 to 4 times a week, that isn't really practice then. If you were boxing, playing the violin, or learning computer repair I'd say the same.

I've been watching this thread with great interest as there is so much I can learn from your discussion. If there's any single greatest takeaway for me it is the above paragraph. I've been stagnating in my journey for the last couple of months, barely feeling the energy to devote to meditation or to work on energy work or telepathy practice. Starting in January I pretty much stopped trying to do much because of lack of motivation or lack of energy. I've been re-dedicating myself to things this week and the above paragraph could not ring any more true for me than at this moment in my journey. It is a timely reminder that our abilities do not develop, evolve, or improve on their own without our own action. I make this observation not for Inedible but for anyone else watching this discussion, as this is something we all could be reminded of - even the masters.

@ Charles_Odinforce - I don't want to derail the discussion, but I wanted to ask: I am unfamiliar with Reiki as a practice. How different is it than standard energy work? Would the concepts of energy movement, flow, pull, or etc. be the same with Reiki as with normal energy work? Or is Reiki specifically very different? If desired we can take this question to a different topic.

Regholdain wrote:@ Charles_Odinforce - I don't want to derail the discussion, but I wanted to ask: I am unfamiliar with Reiki as a practice. How different is it than standard energy work? Would the concepts of energy movement, flow, pull, or etc. be the same with Reiki as with normal energy work? Or is Reiki specifically very different? If desired we can take this question to a different topic.

This is going to be one of those "it's hard to explain without experiencing it, but I'll do my best" kind of things. The feeling of movement, flow, pull, etc is universal in most energy work. That meaning that each person experiences it a little different, with some commonalities between maybe 80% of all people who practice. With Reiki though there are some "very specifically Reiki" types of things, one of which is the Reiki hot hands (though all forms of Qi/Ki work have reports of this) and the lack of "push" with the energy. With most forms of energy work, we direct energy with our conscious mind. With Reiki we act as a place holder for the energy, being more guided by it than anything else.

The best practitioner I know put it best "We are holding space, if at any moment you find you are doing more than holding space, you have stopped doing only Reiki and are mixing your own energy into this."

Reiki is an attunement to a higher energy, some say a universal energy though I disagree with that definition. By its nature, Reiki is a healing energy (hence I wouldn't classify it as true source/universal) which moves toward the benefit of life. Reiki cannot be used directly for harm, but like all energies, it can be used to amp up a system (chakras or such) for harmful purposes. This is part of what makes Reiki so unique though is that on its own it has no offensive/destructive purposes. Reiki simply focuses on healing, nourishing, and bettering that which it is used on.

Since Reiki is an attuned energy it can't be "learned" directly, at least officially. This is one of those "if I say you have spontaneously attuned to Reiki without myself or someone else attuning you, I'm making a judgment call outside what the system itself defines as the way of things" kind of moments. Its the same as not being able to say you are a Master of Karate without you going through a Dojo or instructor training you. With anything that is an attunement it is wrong of even an experienced practitioner to say "Oh yes you have learned this thing that must be passed on" instead we must say "Yes that seems it is very much like this thing that must be passed on, but I can not call it that for traditions sake." So you can learn Karate from a book, but only a master can call you part of the lineage. It doesn't mean you can't fight, and likewise, before my own first Reiki attunement, I practiced an art form similar to it. I must say this, the attunement opened my eyes to the difference between my "mimicked Reiki" and the real thing.

So I don't know if that explains it all, or answers all of the questions, but perhaps I can explain it as such. It is the difference between me setting a broken bone with my hands (QiGong, Energy Work, Psychic Energy Projection, and the like) and me opening the door for an expert bonesetter (Reiki) who has immense skill in the art setting the broken bone. I keep the door open for him, make sure he has a place to sit while he works. Without my invitation he doesn't just show up, but I'd be an arrogant fool to say I'm doing the work itself.

Inedible wrote:

Lewk wrote: I hope I'm not piling in as an unwelcome guest on this discussion Inedible but...in some practices you can do things with conviction, while retaining healthy skepticism. This bypasses the belief/doubt/proof triangle. This is a very useful tool. It's so subtle that it might be mistaken for playing with words or being trivial.

Until I'm ready to go all in with a technique or system I don't do it. And when I am ready, I put all my focus in on doing it. The thing I refuse to do is to pretend to have experiences when I am not having them. It has to be real.

I get that. Thanks for explaining and good luck with what you're doing of course.

Charles_Odinforce wrote:

Regholdain wrote:@ Charles_Odinforce - I don't want to derail the discussion, but I wanted to ask: I am unfamiliar with Reiki as a practice. How different is it than standard energy work? Would the concepts of energy movement, flow, pull, or etc. be the same with Reiki as with normal energy work? Or is Reiki specifically very different? If desired we can take this question to a different topic.

This is going to be one of those "it's hard to explain without experiencing it, but I'll do my best" kind of things. The feeling of movement, flow, pull, etc is universal in most energy work. That meaning that each person experiences it a little different, .......Without my invitation he doesn't just show up, but I'd be an arrogant fool to say I'm doing the work itself.

Thanks Charles, that definitely helps me understand the difference. Eloquently explained, in fact.

The amount of heat in your hands does not directly indicate the amount of energy flowing through them. Unless, maybe it does because you expect it to. This is not just my own personal beliefs talking here. I have been studying and practicing and talking with people about Reiki for a long time. And just like the guy who only has a hammer, I have started to see everything as a nail. But with Reiki. It has been my most reliable tool over the years and I use it on everything I can think of. This includes family, both living and dead. My own past and future lives. I have interacted with Guides, Angels, various Spirits, and my own Higher Self over the years. It just doesn't really feel like success on my part because it doesn't ever seem like something I can take credit for. My biggest problem is that I have trouble with the Spirits from CH. I can't seem to bridge the gap with them.

All the back and forth here reminds me of a time when I was in High School. I went with a friend to a sort of art or culture event. It doesn't really matter. Several blocks down by the river were blocked off to traffic and there were booths set up. I like coffee, and I saw one set up for selling Irish coffee. It is just regular brewed coffee with Irish whiskey, whipped cream from a can, and a couple of those little maraschino cherries that have all the food coloring and sugar to preserve them. Back then I was too young to buy alcohol, but I wanted the coffee with the rest of the fixings. So I went to the booth and asked the seller to let me buy one without alcohol. He asked for my ID and I told him it isn't important because I am underage. And all I want is the coffee with the whipped topping and cherries. No whiskey. We go back and forth and I don't understand why he won't sell me the coffee. My friend's dad shows up and asks me what the problem is. He tells me that the magic word is virgin. A minute later, I am drinking coffee with whipped topping and cherries, but it was such a bother getting it that I am not really fully appreciating it the way I thought I would. And that doesn't make sense, either. I get the feeling that I keep doing the same thing here on this forum. It is obvious to me what I want to say and somehow it isn't getting across.

Maybe over the weekend I can try the candle thing. It all depends on how things go with my wife and cat. They tend to see the days I don't have to go to work as theirs to plan.

That is such a brilliant explanation.