Living entities = Incarnated?

User avatar
Lewk
sanctified
sanctified
Posts: 5756
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:11 am
Answers: 0
5
You are...: in the learning process
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 300
Spelled Number: 200
Your favorite spirit to work with: Any
If I could be anything, I would be...: Immortal
My super power would be...: Ability to fly
My magical/paranormal name...: Alaric Indigo Root
Zodiac:

calliope56 wrote: Sat Jul 09, 2022 4:52 pm [...]
Lewk, I've thought about how their home world seem real to their inhabitants but to us it's in the astral plane. This may seem silly but our world is physical to us and we exist in it but to them it's not, which is why interacting with our energy vibrations is very difficult and most can move a few atoms around (i.e. share energy with us) but unless they've lived on this plane, they can't. What do you think?
I may have overlooked the second part of your question.

It doesn't seem silly but to be honest I don't know for certain. I'm assuming that the laws of how our physical universe works mean that it would be very unstable if it was very easy for a being on the 'unseen' planes to manipulate matter. It does seem to be generally agreed that it's not easy for spirits to manipulate matter here much.

Other universes may have different laws and cosmological constants. Some might arise but fizzle out quickly due to being highly unstable.

My own pet theory is that 'psi factor' is one of the settings in a physical universe. In our own universe the setting is quite low - which is why I can't just look up and wish a star out of existence. In some universes that arise, if the psi factor setting is very high, the first consciously aware being that wondered to itself 'What would it be like if I wished the Universe out of existence?" might actually do that.

I suppose you could add: in a Universe with a very high psi factor setting, spirits would find it very easy to manipulate matter there. Or maybe there could be a different setting for the ease with which spirits can manipulate matter in a physical universe - the Matter Manipulation Factor (?)


You must stay on the path. Do not leave it.
If you do, you'll never...
find it again.
No matter what may come, stay on...
the path! [Gandalf, in The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]
User avatar
calliope56
neophyte
neophyte
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon May 09, 2022 1:25 pm
Answers: 0
1
You are...: in the learning process
Number of Spirits: 71
My super power would be...: Read other's minds

Lewk wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 5:53 am

Hmm...

I suppose my working assumptions go like this:

- When I journey shamanically or astrally in this realm/world (Earth), I experience things rather like you say but, when I'm fully awake and conscious, the physicality of this world is very tangible & real. ie the world we're living in is material/physical but when we experience it psychically - for want of a better word - we're experiencing the Earth realm 'psychically' just as we would the Astral or Spiritual realms.

- Scientific measurements are pretty good at describing our physical reality and there are well developed theories on parallel universes and the multiverse. An excellent overview of this is Brian Greene's book

https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Reality-P ... 0307278123

There are (potentially, theoretically) many parallel universes that we could call physical. Any 'psychic' traveller from any of those to ours would most likely experience it like we would going to theirs - ie as a shamanic/astral journey.

- In theories about the astral, there are thought to also be many non-physical (ie totally 'astral' realms), which also form their own kind of multiverse. (Actually I think the complete Multiverse includes both physical and non-physical universes/realities/realms. These are going to vary enormously and I think overall that may well include places where the beings experience it very like a physical universe.)

If I now come back to how all this directly relates to the thread topic...

I think...

* Living entities must include both types: a) the ones that are incarnated in a physical reality that scientists would recognise and be able to measure; and b) the ones that are Living on what we could call the Astral or Spiritual Realms (to use CH terms).

* Whichever type a Living Entity is, unbound or bound, they're going to visit us 'psychically'. Basically that means what many would call astral travel.

* Creepy Hollows are probably best placed to answer questions on what the place any particular LE comes from is really like (ie is it a 'real' or 'astral' place). I've noticed quite a variation in the Shop descriptions.

* I find it hard to figure out for myself. As with many of these things, there are differing philosophies. Before encountering spirit keeping, I used to think of beings like mermaid spirits as living beings that inhabit the astral. In CH philosophy they used to live here on Earth and what are conjured tend to be spirits of those who were formerly incarnate. Yet on the Mystic Morning Treasures website Lisa describes all of her conjures as living beings - in a different way to how CH defines it.

tl/dr: So I think if we first decide what our philosophy is then we can work out what we think about all of these things. We don't and won't all think alike. Much about the paranormal will always be ineffable and beyond logical understanding. And I think a case can be made that no philosophy or belief can ever be perfectly accurate.

I hope you'll bear with me if I expand on that last point.

cf Karl Popper and Robert Anton Wilson.

"According to Popper, a theory in the empirical sciences can never be proven, but it can be falsified, meaning that it can (and should) be scrutinised with decisive experiments."

"He also held that scientific theory, and human knowledge generally, is irreducibly conjectural or hypothetical, and is generated by the creative imagination to solve problems that have arisen in specific historico-cultural settings."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper

“I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions.”
― Robert Anton Wilson

“...when dogma enters the brain, all intellectual activity ceases. ”
― Robert Anton Wilson, Cosmic Trigger Volume I: Final Secret of the Illuminati

“When we meet somebody whose separate tunnel-reality is obviously far different from ours, we are a bit frightened and always disoriented. We tend to think they are mad, or that they are crooks trying to con us in some way, or that they are hoaxers playing a joke. Yet it is neurologically obvious that no two brains have the same genetically-programmed hard wiring, the same imprints, the same conditioning, the same learning experiences. We are all living in separate realities. That is why communication fails so often, and misunderstandings and resentments are so common. I say "meow" and you say "Bow-wow," and each of us is convinced the other is a bit dumb.”
― Robert Anton Wilson, Prometheus Rising

https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes ... ton_Wilson
Thank-you for your thoughtful answer. I read your post yesterday and am re-reading it today. I don't know anything about parallel universes or the multiverse and I barely understand the astral realm, except that it's a celestial body. I feel like I understand what you're saying but I know that what I understand is much less than you.


User avatar
calliope56
neophyte
neophyte
Posts: 212
Joined: Mon May 09, 2022 1:25 pm
Answers: 0
1
You are...: in the learning process
Number of Spirits: 71
My super power would be...: Read other's minds

Lewk wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 6:09 am
I may have overlooked the second part of your question.

It doesn't seem silly but to be honest I don't know for certain. I'm assuming that the laws of how our physical universe works mean that it would be very unstable if it was very easy for a being on the 'unseen' planes to manipulate matter. It does seem to be generally agreed that it's not easy for spirits to manipulate matter here much.

Other universes may have different laws and cosmological constants. Some might arise but fizzle out quickly due to being highly unstable.

My own pet theory is that 'psi factor' is one of the settings in a physical universe. In our own universe the setting is quite low - which is why I can't just look up and wish a star out of existence. In some universes that arise, if the psi factor setting is very high, the first consciously aware being that wondered to itself 'What would it be like if I wished the Universe out of existence?" might actually do that.

I suppose you could add: in a Universe with a very high psi factor setting, spirits would find it very easy to manipulate matter there. Or maybe there could be a different setting for the ease with which spirits can manipulate matter in a physical universe - the Matter Manipulation Factor (?)
I had to google "psi factor." LOL! I'll leave that topic alone because I'm wholly out of my depths there. I was going to post a follow-up question, although you have clearly indicated that you aren't certain, but then I thought that I'm digressing too much from the OP and question. Thank-you again for your thoughtful responses!


User avatar
Lewk
sanctified
sanctified
Posts: 5756
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 12:11 am
Answers: 0
5
You are...: in the learning process
Male/Female: Male
Number of Spirits: 300
Spelled Number: 200
Your favorite spirit to work with: Any
If I could be anything, I would be...: Immortal
My super power would be...: Ability to fly
My magical/paranormal name...: Alaric Indigo Root
Zodiac:

calliope56 wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 7:06 pm [...]
I had to google "psi factor." LOL! I'll leave that topic alone because I'm wholly out of my depths there. I was going to post a follow-up question, although you have clearly indicated that you aren't certain, but then I thought that I'm digressing too much from the OP and question. Thank-you again for your thoughtful responses!
You're welcome.

I do find it interesting that there is a whole multiverse out there (in theory) in which living entities can exist, either 'incarnated' on what we call the material / earthen plane, or are alive on the non-physical 'unseen' planes - which include what CH call the astral & spiritual realms.


You must stay on the path. Do not leave it.
If you do, you'll never...
find it again.
No matter what may come, stay on...
the path! [Gandalf, in The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]
Post Reply

Return to “Living Entities”