VanNocturne wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:03 am

Side rant; this is why I become annoyed at companies such as Kill Star (for example). I was browsing their website for one of their plus sized hoodie/cloaks, when I stumbled upon their plush toy line, and their "evil devilbaphomet" doll. Now I know why many in the gothic subculture don't like Kill Star. I also tend to do a "chuckle/grunt" when the black metal and death metal bands I go see throw Baphomet/Belial/Lucifer/Satan out there to be scary or edgy. (NUNSLAUGHTER is guilty of that, though I know bands such as NEXUL actually practice what they prea-err scream-about, but now I'm rambling.)
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While this was a side-rant of yours, it's funny as I have bought from Kill Star in the past. I see exactly what you mean and I do not disagree with that annoyance from the perspective of a serious occultist, but I really have always known them to just be taking advantage of occult symbols for fashion reasons - the edge and all - I take them as tongue in cheek or coming from a theatrical impulse which can be ritualistic in itself.

I think we on the occult path need to lighten up enough to embrace that these symbols, even when used with misaligned context, are given power when applied in the natural world and that all power = good power when it can be channeled by the individual.
So I see the point of those that avoid these brands, but I also see the hidden advantage of those supporting them and spreading the message of symbols that can still be harnessed respectfully on sight or by frequency.

It brings me to consider the god Loki, one of my patrons. The Marvel comics-now-movies have brought him great popularity in this 'form' and while he is far more complex than that could ever portray, it is recognizable how this has brought him power. I dislike the Marvel stuff but I appreciate how it has furthered his influence, and at the very least I think we can find this in modern organizations which capitalize on ancient, pagan forces. We need not support them ourselves if it feels off, but we need not be too bothered at the same time.

Vipera aspis atra wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:41 am

VanNocturne wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:03 am

Side rant; this is why I become annoyed at companies such as Kill Star (for example). I was browsing their website for one of their plus sized hoodie/cloaks, when I stumbled upon their plush toy line, and their "evil devilbaphomet" doll. Now I know why many in the gothic subculture don't like Kill Star. I also tend to do a "chuckle/grunt" when the black metal and death metal bands I go see throw Baphomet/Belial/Lucifer/Satan out there to be scary or edgy. (NUNSLAUGHTER is guilty of that, though I know bands such as NEXUL actually practice what they prea-err scream-about, but now I'm rambling.)
.

While this was a side-rant of yours, it's funny as I have bought from Kill Star in the past. I see exactly what you mean and I do not disagree with that annoyance from the perspective of a serious occultist, but I really have always known them to just be taking advantage of occult symbols for fashion reasons - the edge and all - I take them as tongue in cheek or coming from a theatrical impulse which can be ritualistic in itself.

I think we on the occult path need to lighten up enough to embrace that these symbols, even when used with misaligned context, are given power when applied in the natural world and that all power = good power when it can be channeled by the individual.
So I see the point of those that avoid these brands, but I also see the hidden advantage of those supporting them and spreading the message of symbols that can still be harnessed respectfully on sight or by frequency.

It brings me to consider the god Loki, one of my patrons. The Marvel comics-now-movies have brought him great popularity in this 'form' and while he is far more complex than that could ever portray, it is recognizable how this has brought him power. I dislike the Marvel stuff but I appreciate how it has furthered his influence, and at the very least I think we can find this in modern organizations which capitalize on ancient, pagan forces. We need not support them ourselves if it feels off, but we need not be too bothered at the same time.

Without the intent of contradicting myself here, I recently bought a cloak/hoodie from them, and love wearing it!

I see what you're saying Vipera. Using these deities and symbols does "keep them alive", granted they may not be accurate, however this can be used to encourage people to study and research more into the history about said deity or god/dess. As always, you have a well written and thought out response. =3:

reading this thread reminds me of dealing with BA beings nothing to even do with spirit keeping. ASH is very correct. they are trickers but we all know the old say that fits perfect for this. the lord of lies. the masters of deceit. they will tell you and let you feel any sh** you want to hear or know. so you have your illusion of control, power, while they are moving things behind you at the exact same time. iv been there done that dont want to do it again and would like to keep them warded off for the rest of my life.

Thank you Ash for Posting this.

I am giving this a bump.

The description is totally on point. I don't own any. But I was a victim, of Black arts attacks. It came from people I worked/work with. It almost wrecked me.

BUT - to my own training in the paranormal, etc. I managed to come out alive and survived.

I just want to share if anyone reads this post and has experienced any of the symptoms Ash has listed,
a good piece to have is the this from the creepy hollows shop:

Sigils of Magick - Black Arts Protection - i purchased the downloadable copy.

When this BA attack happened, it was very cunning, skillfull, and well planned out. It caught me off gaurd, etc.

The thing that saved me was my "team" and my experience with the paranormal. SO I followed my "teams" advice, and used my training received from various sources, meaning multi di, etc. I survived.

Sigils of Magick - Black Arts Protection - is helping me to clean up the damage that was done, it is a good tool to have.

I was getting hit from different angles and different types of people.

I knew that a doll was being used. Creepy right! But it wasn't just one person using these dolls, it was a group of them.

I saw it today what it was. They got sloppy. What was neat is that a few days ago, I paid off layway and received this spelled item - SEEK ANSWERS & ENCOURAGE YOUR PSYCHIC POWERS :This is a Vabrandi, a "mouth of answers". - This piece showed me - literally at work the following about the doll:
I always knew a doll was being used, but i saw it. This Mexican Lady "granny" style was handing them out to her "peeps" at my job, even my MGR. (Messed up right?) - that is life- people are like that.
I freaked out - because I got confirmation on one aspect of what I was exeriencing at my job. My point is I was able to counter this and live another day. But what is best of all I was able to neutralize it.

My point is I want to thank ASH for this post - because it gave me confirmation as to what was happening to me. I only shared one of the things that was being used. The other stuff was even more intense - it had BA written all over it.

I love the paranormal - I am an explorer, outside of the box thinker, there is more to our lives that we can ever imagine.

Paranormal, parascience, places like CreepyHollows, are truly special places that educate, and are amazing resources.

I guess that's my abbreviated share.

PEACE