A Daemon and a Demon are two, completely different entities. It's similarly spelled, but absolutely NOT the same.

the problem is classification.there are so many different types but ''demon'' has become a catch all phrase for anything ''darker'' to most people.

Like fairy.its another catch all phrase.

the only solution i see is everyone agreeing on what is and isn't a demon and that will never happen.

creepyhollows wrote:A Daemon and a Demon are two, completely different entities. It's similarly spelled, but absolutely NOT the same.

I find the subject of definitions extremely interesting, does language really creates reality or is it the other way around? Should I assume that some demons don't like to be called daemons? Also, how is it that godforms are adopted and changed by the conquering civilization from natives spawning forth a seemingly different god.

I ask because I haven't talked with one, although I'm sure some have tried to mess around not only just that but because of people like Michael J. Ford referring them as being the same plus what I've learned from P. Carroll.

I'm also curious to know the difference between the two... In syntax I can see that the letter e is a flipped letter a, or is it the other way around?

I hope I'm not coming off as a jerk, I have the best regards for CH I just find this fascinating.

Of course, this is why definitions are so important.

CH definition for Daemon:
The spirits of dead heroes these inferior divinities are the go-between for humans and the Immortals. They are malevolent and benevolent as they were once human they have the same mood swings and emotions. When shown respect they provide their Keeper with a profound connection to the Immortals unattainable without them, good fortune and protection. They are often likened to guardian angels.

CH summons the dead heroes and these are the daemons they work with.

However, others have different definitions. There are more beings who are called daemons and as in the quote posted earlier in the thread, some ancient evil spirits were later called daemons.

Take a look at the demonology encyclopedia I linked to earlier and look up daemon and you will see that the spirits of dead heroes is one type of daemon, among others who have been called by the same name.

This is a good example of why people need to know the definition the seller is working with, or what we are speaking of in discussions, because one person's definition is not the same as another's, and two beings who are going by the same name can be completely different sorts of beings.

Got it, thanks Adelphia

I found this article which I found very interesting:
"The "Devil" in "Hell" is the "Source" of Evil
If US Television represents the modern storyteller, then the "packaging" of evil in a Hollywood sense provides for a simple, easy to understand narrative: "The source of greatest is Evil is The Devil, otherwise known by a string of aliases such as Lucifer and Satan. The Devil exists in Hell and his job is tempt humanity and torture condemned souls."
This is close to what many millions of children are taught around the world, especially by christian churches. Many believe it. Even the Catholic Church is adamant that this narrative is true and that the existence of "The Devil" is indisputable. Why then do so many people doubt the existence of the personification of evil?
Could it be because the simple narrative we just described, the narrative promoted heavily by mainstream christian churches and endorsed by the Vatican is nothing more than a 20th Century marketing myth- created much like those other great consumer myths - Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny?
It's pretty easy to see. Look up the origin of the word "Hell" on the world wide web and you'll quickly see it was originally the name of a Nordic goddess of the underworld 1,500 years ago. The word "Devil" is Greek (diabaulus) meaning slander, traduce and it wasn't used as a label for the supreme evil being until well into the 6th and 7th Century CE.
How then can we make sense of the true meaning and origins of evil?
The origin of word (Etymology)
Our first mistake in trying to understand the meaning of "evil" is in thinking of a kind of negative force, rather than a singular entity.
The word evil itself is translated from the Ancient Greek word for an ancient demon spirit ubel, which is equivalent to the the Hebrew name azazel for the same spirit. In Olde English, the word was spelt yfel and later ivell and evyl.
In the earliest meaning and origin of the name azazel (evil) is that he was believed to be a demi-God cast down by the gods for his actions against humanity and doomed to wander the Earth never to escape until the end of time. In Biblican stories, this equates to the story of the archangel Michael and the story now associated to the history of The Devil.
However, in escoteric Jewish traditions, azazel was not the sole evil spirit, but one of seventy-two (72) demons who when they assisted were arch-angels and when they were called to curse others were demons.
Therefore the word evil in its earliest sense, is evil incarnate- the physical manifestation of ill, badness or azazel. While the original meaning of evil as the title of the supreme bad spirit has been lost, evil retains strong negative meanings, including “bad in a positive sense, morally depraved, doing, or tending to do harm.”
In this understanding of evil as literally the personification of negativity as a spirit that we find a rich history across the ancient cultures including Mesopotamia, Syria, Egypt, Greece, Rome, Spain and Northern Europe in the connection between different labels meaning similar things. "

http://one-evil.org/evil/evil_meaning.htm

When I think about demons, prior to being exposed to spirit keeping, is that they are entities that have malicious intent.

Limited, I know, but it's because in the Vietnamese context, the word "ma" means ghost, where as when you add another word to it, "ma gui" means demons. "Gui" by itself doesn't have much of a meaning, but added to the word ghost, it basically means bad ghost. Bad ghost pretty much means anything that's not an angel, "tien," god, "than" (sp?), or human, "nguoi."

Then, after growing up as a Catholic, I'm taught that anything entity that's not alive (spirits and so on) are evil spirits trying to tempt humans because they're not in heaven.

After being exposed to spirit keeping, my definition was revised a bit... I feel like most bound entities that are considered demons are more DA than BA because it makes me wonder if you can truly bound a BA demon. Not to mention, allegedly properly bound demons do not have much room to harm you though you can never be too safe.

I feel like it's hard to really have a spectrum and say: "After this point, this is a demon" because I don't think the spectrum is all that linear, especially when you consider the person who interacts with the entity. So when you (the keeper) have, say, a wraith, you consider him/her a vengeful DA spirit. However, the person on the receiving end (after having done something unjust to you) do not know what's going on. All they know is that they have a bunch of bad stuff happening to them, and if you have no rules, something just gave them nightmares and pushed them down the stairs. So yea, they MIGHT think it's a demon because they don't know for sure and from what their perspective, it's evil.

Ivy Onyx East wrote:I found this article which I found very interesting:
"The "Devil" in "Hell" is the "Source" of Evil
If US Television represents the modern storyteller, then the "packaging" of evil in a Hollywood sense provides for a simple, easy to understand narrative: "The source of greatest is Evil is The Devil, otherwise known by a string of aliases such as Lucifer and Satan. The Devil exists in Hell and his job is tempt humanity and torture condemned souls."
This is close to what many millions of children are taught around the world, especially by christian churches. Many believe it. Even the Catholic Church is adamant that this narrative is true and that the existence of "The Devil" is indisputable. Why then do so many people doubt the existence of the personification of evil?
Could it be because the simple narrative we just described, the narrative promoted heavily by mainstream christian churches and endorsed by the Vatican is nothing more than a 20th Century marketing myth- created much like those other great consumer myths - Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny?
It's pretty easy to see. Look up the origin of the word "Hell" on the world wide web and you'll quickly see it was originally the name of a Nordic goddess of the underworld 1,500 years ago. The word "Devil" is Greek (diabaulus) meaning slander, traduce and it wasn't used as a label for the supreme evil being until well into the 6th and 7th Century CE.
How then can we make sense of the true meaning and origins of evil?
The origin of word (Etymology)
Our first mistake in trying to understand the meaning of "evil" is in thinking of a kind of negative force, rather than a singular entity.
The word evil itself is translated from the Ancient Greek word for an ancient demon spirit ubel, which is equivalent to the the Hebrew name azazel for the same spirit. In Olde English, the word was spelt yfel and later ivell and evyl.
In the earliest meaning and origin of the name azazel (evil) is that he was believed to be a demi-God cast down by the gods for his actions against humanity and doomed to wander the Earth never to escape until the end of time. In Biblican stories, this equates to the story of the archangel Michael and the story now associated to the history of The Devil.
However, in escoteric Jewish traditions, azazel was not the sole evil spirit, but one of seventy-two (72) demons who when they assisted were arch-angels and when they were called to curse others were demons.
Therefore the word evil in its earliest sense, is evil incarnate- the physical manifestation of ill, badness or azazel. While the original meaning of evil as the title of the supreme bad spirit has been lost, evil retains strong negative meanings, including “bad in a positive sense, morally depraved, doing, or tending to do harm.”
In this understanding of evil as literally the personification of negativity as a spirit that we find a rich history across the ancient cultures including Mesopotamia, Syria, Egypt, Greece, Rome, Spain and Northern Europe in the connection between different labels meaning similar things. "

http://one-evil.org/evil/evil_meaning.htm

Well said!!! Amazing!!!!

Ruby wrote:When I think about demons, prior to being exposed to spirit keeping, is that they are entities that have malicious intent.

Limited, I know, but it's because in the Vietnamese context, the word "ma" means ghost, where as when you add another word to it, "ma gui" means demons. "Gui" by itself doesn't have much of a meaning, but added to the word ghost, it basically means bad ghost. Bad ghost pretty much means anything that's not an angel, "tien," god, "than" (sp?), or human, "nguoi."

Then, after growing up as a Catholic, I'm taught that anything entity that's not alive (spirits and so on) are evil spirits trying to tempt humans because they're not in heaven.

After being exposed to spirit keeping, my definition was revised a bit... I feel like most bound entities that are considered demons are more DA than BA because it makes me wonder if you can truly bound a BA demon. Not to mention, allegedly properly bound demons do not have much room to harm you though you can never be too safe.

I feel like it's hard to really have a spectrum and say: "After this point, this is a demon" because I don't think the spectrum is all that linear, especially when you consider the person who interacts with the entity. So when you (the keeper) have, say, a wraith, you consider him/her a vengeful DA spirit. However, the person on the receiving end (after having done something unjust to you) do not know what's going on. All they know is that they have a bunch of bad stuff happening to them, and if you have no rules, something just gave them nightmares and pushed them down the stairs. So yea, they MIGHT think it's a demon because they don't know for sure and from what their perspective, it's evil.

Intelligently put!! Great answer!!!

More classifications to consider:

Psellus, Michael (1018–ca. 1078) Byzantine scholar,
philosopher, author, and statesman, who undertook a
classifi cation of DEMONs in his work On the Work of
Demons.

Michael Psellus was born in Constantinople, where he
rose to prominence in the royal court as a lawyer and philosopher.
He became imperial secretary under Emperor
Michael V in 1041–42. He taught philosophy at the Academy
at Constantinople, where he advocated the ideas of
Plato over those of the more popular Aristotle.
Psellus’ book On the Work of Demons was translated
into Latin by Marsilio Ficino, and then into Italian by a
mid-16th-century scholar. He said the DEVIL was the artifi
cer of all evils, the lord of subcelestial things, and the
counterpart to God.

In the Neoplatonic view, demons were more like the
Greek DAIMONES, morally ambivalent intermediary beings
rather than FALLEN ANGELS. Psellus’ demonic classes are

• leliouria, shining or glowing ones who live in the
ether, a rarifi ed sphere beyond the Moon
• aeria, demons of the air below the Moon
• chthonia, demons who live on the land
• hydraia or enalia, demons who live in the water
• hypochthonia, demons who live beneath the earth
• misophaes, blind and nearly senseless demons who
hate the light and live in the lowest parts of HELL

Demons swarm everywhere. Higher demons act on
the intellect, imagination, and senses, and lower demons
are animalistic, causing disease and bad luck and engag-
ing in POSSESSION. Lower demons can speak, and they utter
false prophecies.

Demons can be repelled by sacred words and objects
in Christianity, Psellus said, and by holy women and men,
who can cause them great pain.

-Encyclopedia of Demons and Demonology