Treat demons with respect....

Is the moral of the story...

Its. Pointless to argue and even more pointless to argue with a smartphone..

Enochian Magic is a very powerfully field of magic and it was introduced by a charlattan...

Concerning the scriptures, I study them because I study the kaballa which is another very effective branch of magic..
Anytime I have dealt with an Angel or Demon I always give a gift of energy or some equivalent..

There is always a gift given and one received.. .

I apologize to Adelphia and all for the poorly constructed argument on both parts and any insults, because in the grand scheme of things..

Who really cares?

Does your opinion or my opinion matter... No!

So with that good night and I wish you all the best....

Heading Bahrain ,

I pray my safe arrival, but nothing is for certain and this is the reason none of this matters...

Frater Y.A. wrote:What's really funny is that your entire rebuttal is an argument of ignorance and and worthless speculation....

You did a thesis on the Tanak and new testament and you don't know simple truths means your a fool....

If the doctor was a charlatan why does enochian magic work so well?

The problem with idiots is you start off talking like you know something, but in truth you know nothing and make yourself a fool...

This is the problem with the community we have a bunch of dabblers with a bunch of really expensive books who after purchasing a demon or two think they are practitioners...

Really?

All those words, well written only to look lik
And to claim a system of very effective magivk is a fraud..

How many real practitioner here have used enochian vision/magic to great affect, please leave a smiley face, because this is outrageous.
Everything you wrote must have been out of rage, because it was all LAN eargument of ignorance.


Go away little book witch, get with a group of real practitioners to clear up your blatant ignorance....

Really?

You can't be serious, the best part of your argument of ignorance is the humorous ignorance..

I wish you the best life you can possibly have in your world of ignorance, speculation and if norance....

You obviously have no idea what your talking about, but it was well written..

More than I can say for my lazy amused reply from my smartphone...

Creepy hollows please make this place cell phone friendly..

Would you like to learn enochian magic... Yes? No?

It amuzes me that you are the only one replying in rage and did not offer a counter-argument in return other than childish insults as if in a Tantrum. As for the so called "Simple Truths" perhaps they need to be simple for you so that you can understand them since the truth is never simple otherwise we all would know it and arguments such as this would otherwise not exist.

As for Enochian Magick, even the Sygil used is NOT original to Edward Kelly but the actual designer of the Sygil was Probably the oldest known description and image of the Sigillum Dei is the 14th Century Liber iuratus (also Liber sacratus, Liber sacer sive iuratus, or Sworn Booke),[1] attributed to Honorius, son of Euclid.[2] This may have been produced in the late 13th century, but likely not before the time of Pope John XXII. (1316–1334).[. As for it working so well... mute point that serves to do nothing more than endow the practitioner with self agrandizement. I will wait for those smiley faces to come up with detained breath. BTW The sygil itself is fraud, NOT the procedure itself since Crystalomancy (which is the method used by Kelly to speak and see the "angels") is a true and proven method.

Was this really necesary: Go away little book witch, get with a group of real practitioners to clear up your blatant ignorance.... It seems to me the grand master wizard needs a time out. If this is your responce when someone questions objectively the methods available out there for occult practice, I can see you have a long road ahead of you to become the "High Grand Master Super Spiritual Adept" that you so desperately seek to be. Insults are not necessary but you have to remember YOU were the one who started it. I just repayed you with the same coin. Don't get mad! It's really unbecoming to an Enochian Magickian, even more so to a Kabbalist.

You do understand what "Argument of Ignorance" means, do you? Because the answer you supplied points to the opposite: "You can't be serious, the best part of your argument of ignorance is the humorous ignorance.."

Do you asume this of everyone here who disagrees with your methods? "This is the problem with the community we have a bunch of dabblers with a bunch of really expensive books who after purchasing a demon or two think they are practitioners..." Did it ever occur to you that some of us actually know what we are talking about? I for one believe the vast majority in this forum know a thing or two about magick and spirit keeping and assumptions like this one are insulting to all of us.

Interesting thing is, for an "adept" (and I hesitate to use the word here) you really have a very short fuse and low tolerance for criticism when backed up with historical and empirical data (unlike the data abscent to substantiate your argument). Discipline is lacking!! You have already demonstrated that to all of us here in this forum by your angry responces and puerile insults.

I DO hope you grow out of this recalcitrant attitude of yours soon and unlike you I truly hope the best for you despite the above diatribes and platitudes.

Be it as it may...

Frater Y.A. wrote:Treat demons with respect....

Is the moral of the story...

Its. Pointless to argue and even more pointless to argue with a smartphone..

Enochian Magic is a very powerfully field of magic and it was introduced by a charlattan...

Concerning the scriptures, I study them because I study the kaballa which is another very effective branch of magic..
Anytime I have dealt with an Angel or Demon I always give a gift of energy or some equivalent..

There is always a gift given and one received.. .

I apologize to Adelphia and all for the poorly constructed argument on both parts and any insults, because in the grand scheme of things..

Who really cares?

Does your opinion or my opinion matter... No!

So with that good night and I wish you all the best....

Heading Bahrain ,

I pray my safe arrival, but nothing is for certain and this is the reason none of this matters...

Agreed, but DO NOT apologize for me. I'm more tha capable of doing this myself. But Thank you!

Falicea272 wrote:

Frater Y.A. wrote:What's really funny is that your entire rebuttal is an argument of ignorance and and worthless speculation....

You did a thesis on the Tanak and new testament and you don't know simple truths means your a fool....

If the doctor was a charlatan why does enochian magic work so well?

The problem with idiots is you start off talking like you know something, but in truth you know nothing and make yourself a fool...

This is the problem with the community we have a bunch of dabblers with a bunch of really expensive books who after purchasing a demon or two think they are practitioners...

Really?

All those words, well written only to look lik
And to claim a system of very effective magivk is a fraud..

How many real practitioner here have used enochian vision/magic to great affect, please leave a smiley face, because this is outrageous.
Everything you wrote must have been out of rage, because it was all LAN eargument of ignorance.


Go away little book witch, get with a group of real practitioners to clear up your blatant ignorance....

Really?

You can't be serious, the best part of your argument of ignorance is the humorous ignorance..

I wish you the best life you can possibly have in your world of ignorance, speculation and if norance....

You obviously have no idea what your talking about, but it was well written..

More than I can say for my lazy amused reply from my smartphone...

Creepy hollows please make this place cell phone friendly..

Would you like to learn enochian magic... Yes? No?

It amuzes me that you are the only one replying in rage and did not offer a counter-argument in return other than childish insults as if in a Tantrum. As for the so called "Simple Truths" perhaps they need to be simple for you so that you can understand them since the truth is never simple otherwise we all would know it and arguments such as this would otherwise not exist.

As for Enochian Magick, even the Sygil used is NOT original to Edward Kelly but the actual designer of the Sygil was Probably the oldest known description and image of the Sigillum Dei is the 14th Century Liber iuratus (also Liber sacratus, Liber sacer sive iuratus, or Sworn Booke),[1] attributed to Honorius, son of Euclid.[2] This may have been produced in the late 13th century, but likely not before the time of Pope John XXII. (1316–1334).[. As for it working so well... mute point that serves to do nothing more than endow the practitioner with self agrandizement. I will wait for those smiley faces to come up with detained breath. BTW The sygil itself is fraud, NOT the procedure itself since Crystalomancy (which is the method used by Kelly to speak and see the "angels") is a true and proven method.

Was this really necesary: Go away little book witch, get with a group of real practitioners to clear up your blatant ignorance.... It seems to me the grand master wizard needs a time out. If this is your responce when someone questions objectively the methods available out there for occult practice, I can see you have a long road ahead of you to become the "High Grand Master Super Spiritual Adept" that you so desperately seek to be. Insults are not necessary but you have to remember YOU were the one who started it. I just repayed you with the same coin. Don't get mad! It's really unbecoming to an Enochian Magickian, even more so to a Kabbalist.

You do understand what "Argument of Ignorance" means, do you? Because the answer you supplied points to the opposite: "You can't be serious, the best part of your argument of ignorance is the humorous ignorance.."

Do you asume this of everyone here who disagrees with your methods? "This is the problem with the community we have a bunch of dabblers with a bunch of really expensive books who after purchasing a demon or two think they are practitioners..." Did it ever occur to you that some of us actually know what we are talking about? I for one believe the vast majority in this forum know a thing or two about magick and spirit keeping and assumptions like this one are insulting to all of us.

Interesting thing is, for an "adept" (and I hesitate to use the word here) you really have a very short fuse and low tolerance for criticism when backed up with historical and empirical data (unlike the data abscent to substantiate your argument). Discipline is lacking!! You have already demonstrated that to all of us here in this forum by your angry responces and puerile insults.

I DO hope you grow out of this recalcitrant attitude of yours soon and unlike you I truly hope the best for you despite the above diatribes and platitudes.

Be it as it may...

I got a little heated when you stated a very advanced form of magick is a sham... Actually you wrote the creator was a fraud, thus his system is a fraud..

Is this correct, because that is totally untrue....

You quoted the bible and claimed to have written a thesis on it, but yet your knowledge of it is weak and upon correction you claim I was speculating...

Your other point was that it was a contradiction and if so why would you quote an opinion as truth which was wrong if you believe it was an opinion...

You use mary as a side post to drive your argument, but your information was wrong concerning the immaculate deception and I corrected you... This is actually when you claimed the book is a contradicting piece of fiction...

Did you know every point we made was an argument of ignorance, because we both lacked the knowledge to prove our statments contrary to each others opinioin..

At one point you claimed I was speculating when I was quoting directly from the scriptures you claimed to know so well...

I know you used a biblical example to illustrate a point and not to prove the validity of it, but you could have atleast got it right... Especially, since you quoted the bible and I would expect the same from the koran, talmud, book of yasher, or torah in which that story dwells..

Do you see the problem in this?

Yes demon is a man made word, true, but you used it specifically so I challenged that word with truth, because in and of itself it means nothing and is overused.... Actually, demon come from the greek word daemon and is used for both good and bad spirits...

Concerning Parthenogenesis it only happens in plants and some insects, but has never happened or has been recorded happening in mammals, specifically humans...

Only in legend and they are flimsy at best...

Concerning Conjuring:

Do you not set up your sacred space to attract the entity you desire with the proper correspondences to be pleasing unto the entity or spirt?

Is this not payment, a gift or is this more babbling...

Is there not incense offered and other offering during this sacred time within your sacred space or am I babbling?

Concerning the tomgue:

If a spirit or entity request something of you in exchange for services if you agree to terms should you not offer payment?

"All light gives off shadow and all shadow is born from light.." Quantum wave theory. If it is quantum wave theory great, but its the truth...

I didnt insult you I said you were ignorant... It just means you dont know and I apologized for my outburst...

Somethings you said were untrue, regardless if you were making a point by illustration your illustration should have been based on truth and not speculation...

It seems you reacted because maybe you think I have a problem with demons... I dont... I actually have had some really deep conversations with them and I dont fear them at all...


Concerning Super Adept:
I do not claim some high form of enlightenment.
Actually, Im quite the opposite...
I was trained to kill and I learned how to heal to pacify my own demons...
I drink tequila and smoke a hookah with friends in Dubai and Bahrain..
I hate republicans and democrats and would vote for ron Paul which is hopeless, but I would..
I travel around teaching people how to mitigate, assess and handle threats.

In a nut shell how to catch very bad people and then extract information from them... Defiantly not a super enlightened Adept, just a guy who had a hard time sleeping at night who one day learned how to silence his mind and nothing more..

Nothing special, handsome, but defiantly not special....

You thought I was mad?

I wasn't..

actually, I could careless...

however me calling you ignorant, because you misquoted a few things is just normal...

Funny, you backed up nothing with data, but you did wield your opinion as truth and there in lies the problem..

I apologized for myself and my reaction..

I would never apologized for you, because it is not my place...

But in the end, what does it matter?

So what I disagreed with you....

You disagreed with me..

We went back and forth...

For what?

You have no effect on my life and I dont have any effect on yours...

Yes in our own unique way we said, the other was a moron, but tomorrow none of this will matter....

Upon looking in the abyss which if you've been dealing with demons you have peered into it...

And you know
None of this sh*t matters anyway, but to indulge, rant and bicker somehow makes us all feel a little more human, more in control and more valid, but in truth we all return to nothing and thus nothing really matters accept the next moment of inhaled fresh air....

Because soon we will all exhale and be no more....

FYA

Umm..... Can we go back to respectfully sharing info and opinions and drop the ego battles? I was actually interested in reading this thread lol.

:facepalm::

Lady Elisa wrote:Umm..... Can we go back to respectfully sharing info and opinions and drop the ego battles? I was actually interested in reading this thread lol.

:facepalm::

I apologize

I wish I could erase all, but I cant..

For some reason I am always disrupting the flow of things...

Frater Y.A. wrote:

Lady Elisa wrote:Umm..... Can we go back to respectfully sharing info and opinions and drop the ego battles? I was actually interested in reading this thread lol.

:facepalm::

I apologize

I wish I could erase all, but I cant..

For some reason I am always disrupting the flow of things...

No, I wasn't blaming you and I'm sure you don't do that
Just meant in general. Unfortunately I can't really contribute as I don't know much about demons but I'm ready and anxious to learn!!!
*pulls out notepad* lol :

Frater Y.A. wrote:
Demon is a man made term as is angel....

The spirit world does operate in black and white and varied colors inbetween specifically for judgement...

That world is different than this and wisdom, knowledge and understanding is complete within this world... It is nothing like the human world in no sense of the word or world.

There is a price that comes into play when working with both angels and demons, using the terms in the general...

Concerning your description of angel from the biblical perspective these beings where commanded to do such by a power greater than them...


A soldier always follows orders as do demons follow orders as well...

Concerning mary if you look deeply within the scripture you will see that the immaculate conception is a lie and hold no more water than a jug with holes.... There was no violation. The birth was natural, if it was not than how would the child be direct descendant of Da"vid...

You guys really got to study before you spew nonsense...


Angels nor demons are benign and the conjurer or evocatoinist(made up word) is in as much danger when dealing with both if the operator is a fool...

However, with an in depth study of the Sigillum De Aemeth one begins to see that the potential for demons and angels as we know them to be but one or the same thing....

All light gives off shadow and all shadow is born from light..

The truth is simple they are one and the same, beings of duality, same consciousness just experiencing life on separate planes, thus I can bind a devil with an angel that correlates and in some cases vice/vers..

As above so below and as below so above...


FYA

:ot:

Hi Frater. This is interesting line of thought, that which I was suspecting and contemplating for some time. Can you expand on this thought further? I would love to hear more about the relation between Angels and Demons and their behavioural instinct, whether religiously affiliated or non religiously affiliated.

I wrote a thread about it here.

http://www.creepyhollows.com/phpBB3/vie ... lit=Angels

I think we need to completely walk away from Mediaeval Nomenclature Defining Classification Categories (Pre-mediaeval Nomencalture Cateogries are ok, however) in all of the Occult and as a sade issue - also we need a Table of Modern Definition for all Alchemical words and phrases....


Demon, Daemones, etc is vague contradicoty, and has been gven conflicting definitions...Don't try to fix it...rebuild it...


Caiyros

CaiyrosArlenLeStrang wrote:I think we need to completely walk away from Mediaeval Nomenclature Defining Classification Categories (Pre-mediaeval Nomencalture Cateogries are ok, however) in all of the Occult and as a sade issue - also we need a Table of Modern Definition for all Alchemical words and phrases....


Demon, Daemones, etc is vague contradicoty, and has been gven conflicting definitions...Don't try to fix it...rebuild it...


Caiyros

I agree we need better definitions.