Very insightful i have greatly enjoyed reading this

this was an interesting read !

I do understand both sides of the argument. For the customer, they should have the right to know what is really on the vessel. But at the same time it is easy for the reader to misinterpret what is actually going on. Whether purposeful or mistaken, we will never know. Everybody has their version of reality.

Some believe everyone is out to lie, so they will find a way to turn their reading into such and sometimes it has nothing to do with the conjurer/seller or reality for that matter. And quite frankly, some really do lie, because it is so easy to.

I would say the wisest thing for a reader to do if they read is to say "I am not getting a connection at this time" or "My current method is not getting a connection." No one should have to say it is empty or put anyone's work down.

Even if their version truth is based on good intentions, as they say the road to hell is PAVED with good intention.

I think about a month ago, some kid came into the chatroom. I don't remember his ID. He told us he had "gotten rid" of one of his spirits, because it was "evil."

We asked how he knew it was evil, and he told us, it was because a different, second seller, had read the vessel, and told him so. He took in a spirit from a first seller, without completely understanding what he was bringing home... and then took the word of a second seller, who might, or might not, have had ulterior motives in the transaction, over the first, instead of going back to the original seller with his questions.

We explained this to him, and he got rather upset. "Of course the spirit was evil, it came from Hell." When we politely requested to know WHICH hell he was referring to, he told us, confusedly, "All Hell! What do you mean, which Hell."

We then explained that there are many "Hells" - and that some, such as the Elysian Fields, are only nominally considered to be Hell realms because they are in an Underworld, but that they are still Heaven-like, and made for heroes and good people who deserve a good rest after their lives, but haven't earned the status of Demigod.

He then proceeded to call us Idolaters and Devil Worshipers, and the conversation devolved from there. Honestly, since he was clearly coming from a really right-wing Christian construct, I rather thought he probably wasn't ready for keeping... and I referred him to his own holy book, and a long list of what his book has to say about his God's views on people who work with spirits.

He left, most upset.

However... you can clearly see that, had he never had the spirit's vessel read in the first place, but simply spoken with the original seller about whatever issue it was that he was having, the resultant problems, and possible fraud, would also not have occurred.

If you have a vessel and you don't have the ability yet to read it yourself... go back to the original seller. You cannot go find a listing on the MP or anywhere else and assume that the next seller to read your vessels is completely neutral. This is their livelihood... and not all of them are ethical, and those unethical ones are going to tell you that there's nothing there, or that you've got something you didn't order, to discredit other sellers, and encourage you to buy from them, the "real" sellers, instead.

Read My Vessel threads are not the only issue - Read My Vessel readings... you are putting your trust in someone and you don't know whether or not they have ulterior motives, or what their ethical perspectives are, unless you have been working with them a long time, and you know them well.

There are only two sellers I can think of, off the top of my head, that I would trust to read my vessels, other than myself, right now - except for the sellers of the vessels themselves, that is - and they are Creepy Hollows and Lisa (Real Magick) - and I'm fairly sure that neither of them actually offer the service... for just the reasons listed above - it's an ethics thing.

Just thought I'd share that sad story with you.

And... kiddo... whatever your name is, if you're still out there... and you happen to know what you did with that vessel, and can get it back... please, either send it back to the seller... or send it to me. What you did to that poor spirit is... horrible, and while I completely understand it wasn't completely your fault... I would like to rectify the mistakes made by all the parties in that situation.

Blessings...
Lemon

My biggest concern is being unable to verify for myself that what I bought isn't just a plain stone. What about people like me?

Inedible - the longer I spend time on this forum, the more I find that people who cannot sense energy or see spirits are still discovering little ways that their spirits have let them know, "We're here."

Practice and hard work eventually open your senses up, especially once you know what exactly you're supposed to be opening up and how to do that... but before that...

Don't buy from someone you don't trust. Unfortunately... until your spirits let you know, in ways you cannot deny, that they are, in fact, absolutely there... buying from people you trust absolutely is the only solution, because in all of this, you are going on blind faith.

It is, sadly, a stumbling stone for many on this path.

Bright blessings...
Lemon

Lemon, I see that scenerio. But also let me paint you another.

If you have a vessel and you don't have the ability yet to read it yourself... go back to the original seller.

I had a forum friend who began his journey as a newb. Who really just wanted a djinn as a companion, someone to talk to. Soon after he bought the vessel from a regular seller (those reselling used goods), his wife was raped and attacked in front of him, having endless nightmares etc, etc. I'm a djinn owner, so I'm not hating on djinns. Just retelling a story. Well mine don't do that.

Well when he confronted the seller, after he learned some new skills, she eventually confessed she just wanted to get rid of the thing. He even asked her if she sold XYZ a fake after he told her to stop. She said yes, she couldn't help herself. It was so easy. But to that customer she was sweet and didn't admit or deny her wrong doings. Because she was sweet and he was always angry, people believed the sweet one. Typical.

How to tell a liar? They don't believe in their own story, so they really can't elaborate on any answers. It's likely to be short and sweet. It's really that simple.

Inedible wrote:My biggest concern is being unable to verify for myself that what I bought isn't just a plain stone. What about people like me?

If you don't feel something, rather than saying nothing is there, I would practice on meditating with some guided meditations before you sleep. Hold the vessel in your hand, and you will eventually find the nuances. Compare with regular stones, and spirited stones. Eventually one will come out and grab you or spin around you.

On the other hand, if you suddenly receive bad luck and attacks...I wouldn't immediately call it evil, though think twice about keeping the vessel. The spirit might just not want to be with you. If you don't know what it is, just be honest so a more experienced member can take it off your hands.

Wow, I am new to Spirit Keeping and I knew I was a little naive, but had no clue that this was such a problem. I never even had a doubt about whether spirit keeping was real or not. I have had nothing but positive experiences here at CH.

AS to the practice readings I thought that I was helping someone who needed practice doing readings, needed help and was looking for volunteers so that they could get practice in and hone their skills. I had no idea that it could really be harmful, but now that I see from all the different inputs, I now see where it could be potentially harmful to people. I ASSUMED :facepalm:: that people who were deciding to become Spirit Keepers had no doubts that they were in fact giving good homes to spirits. As I said I have had no doubts and no reason to have them! Maybe I trust too much?? ?
I did check to make sure it was okay to share pics( like some of the Forum members) so they could share their experiences with one another. I thought that everyone because I have had nothing but positive experiences, that everyone else did too! Boy, do I feel naive!!
I have had quite the learning experience today and I will be more cautious in the future. But that is how we learn through trial and error.

Ruby wrote:Most of the time, vessel readings are entertaining but I've had headaches with people hounding me about whether what they've bought is spirited and what it is and why it's there and so on. Sometimes, I thought of just tossing out a random spirit type and moving on, but that would be devious of me... but really! It's not like they don't have what it takes to do the reading themselves.

Then there's the thing about people picking up a ring from an antique store and asking whether or not anything's inside. Even that's a bit in the gray area because, like Magnolia said, not every spirit will be willing to speak with just ANYONE. Then there's the thing about the piece of jewelry just having nothing. It could be residual energy from the previous wearer or you just thinking that there's energy because it looks pretty.

Anyway, I am fully behind the thing about what goes on between keeper and spirit is between keeper and spirit. Frankly sometimes I glance at a vessel and I can just feel the brushoff, regardless of what spirit or spelled item it is, because I don't want to know what's going on. Most people doing vessel readings expect positive readings like "Oh she/he's very happy with you" or "Oh, how handsome!" and so on, what do you do when to happen to pick up something negative? You don't wanna tell that person because you don't want to hurt their feelings, besides, you could be wrong, and it's not your place to tell the keeper that their spirit wants to leave them.

I've rambled enough. Blegh.
I've had my fun with vessel readings... and frankly I do feel a bit self-conscious baring my kiddos' vessels to other people. Feels like I'm just throwing out my energy and saying, "Have a bite!"

I have the same feelings. The only people I like to read for are my hubby and two kids.