denanna123 wrote:I'd have to agree with everything Alys has recommended here, she's cited some great source material for starting out in the LHP. And as said LHP doesn't have to mean Black Arts (depending on your definition the term). Not all that is dark (even very dark) is black arts.

Ishvala wrote:

denanna123 wrote:I'd have to agree with everything Alys has recommended here, she's cited some great source material for starting out in the LHP. And as said LHP doesn't have to mean Black Arts (depending on your definition the term). Not all that is dark (even very dark) is black arts.

I completely agree. There are some DA Spirits and Spells that are so in the Grey area they might not even feel that different than a WA. Then there's the other side that people seem infatuated with...lets not forget part of the beauty of the LHP is exploring all manners of the darker spectrum, and not just it's farthest inky depths.

Alys-RaccoonReadings wrote:So, I think what OP describes here conflates a lot of different concepts. And that's very common in this area because there's no widespread consensus on what all of these terms mean.

In its strictest sense, the term BA *as used in the CH forum* describes something as immutable as WA. BA beings have no free will and are bound by their nature. They only desire chaos and destruction. "You must feed the the homeless, the unfortunate ones... ” is not a thing we would hear from a truly BA being, *using this forum's definitions.* (However, different practitioners use different terms in different ways.) Frequently the term is used in the forum to denote restrictions of someone's free will (Magnolia defines BA magick this way often.) Some apply the term to any magick that could cause harm, like hexing/cursing (which I think is a bit much: I personally think there can be a place for offensive magick in a balanced practice and would characterize it as DA rather than BA.) A lot of people use the term BA for anything dark, but because BA means a certain set of things on this forum it attracts much sterner blowback than when used outside the forum. So it can be very helpful in these discussions to make very clear what you mean when you say "BA."

What OP describes is rather closer to Left Hand Path (LHP) than BA. Self-sovereignty and darker beings that are infernal and focused on free will are very LHP. Done at its fullest potential, it is a very demanding and involved path, as well as a rewarding one for those who find their home in it. There are many flavors of LHP. Demonolatry is a very well known path (for that you would check out S Connolly books.) Satanic and Luciferian LHP are also very popular among LHP practitioners, making The Satanic Bible and LeVay a common starting point there. Humanistic LHP is also a thing, but they don't seem to be a very organized lot--they seem to start out in other parts of LHP and paganism and end up with a humanist focus rather than focusing on certain higher-powered beings or magickal systems particularly. Uncle Setnakt's Essential Guide to the Left Hand Path *looks* like it could be a great introductory source, but it comes from members of the Temple of Seth which seems to have a committed community of detractors, so approach with care.

Additionally, shamanism occurs across many cultures, and there are a few things that are really important to know about it as modern, industrialized people. Shamans are always trained via apprenticeship or, more rarely, self-initiation. Self-initiation is a more prevalent in modern practices. A *very* important but often overlooked fact of shamanism is that it is heavily culture-specific and therefore carries very special concerns. It describes many different and distinct traditions, and an attempt to forge a single path out of them will lose a lot of the richness available in these original traditions. At the same time, there can be something gained in exploring shamanism even when you didn't come from a shamanistic tradition or culture. There is no easy answer to the issue of "cultural strip-mining" and appropriation, but seekers MUST seriously wrestle with the question and come to their own conclusions about it if they are to practice in good conscious and get the most they can out of it. At a minimum it would be good manners to find ways to give back to the people or lands utilized in one's studies and try not to unduly enrich random Westerners selling their books and seminars without giving back to their sources. For reading about Shamanism, Mircea Eliade's Shamanism: Archaic Techniques of Ecstasy and Michael Harner's Way Of The Shaman are considered foundational.

That said, for Roseflare, I would start out by figuring out which part of what OP is describing speaks to you. Figure out what's at the heart of it. Sovereignty of the self? Walking in both worlds? Working with darker Powers/beings? The rigor of the initiation and path? Do some poking around the internet and narrow down what you think you are drawn to. Then read a really great book about it. If you get through that book and you're like, "This is for me!" then you start figuring out who you need to talk to if you want to go deeper. None of these paths for you *have* to be dangerous for your kiddo if you approach them with care and rigor.

Since you don't have a specific path or tradition that is calling to you yet, I would start with chaos magick for your protection work. It doesn't require you to call on any one divine being. Learn to ground, center and shield. There's lots of information on this forum and the Internet in general for how to do that. Googling for specific spells can be dodgy, but it can be just fine for these basics.

Ishvala wrote:

denanna123 wrote:I'd have to agree with everything Alys has recommended here, she's cited some great source material for starting out in the LHP. And as said LHP doesn't have to mean Black Arts (depending on your definition the term). Not all that is dark (even very dark) is black arts.

I completely agree. There are some DA Spirits and Spells that are so in the Grey area they might not even feel that different than a WA. Then there's the other side that people seem infatuated with...lets not forget part of the beauty of the LHP is exploring all manners of the darker spectrum, and not just it's farthest inky depths.

Roseflare wrote: I heard about Demonolatry the other day. It sort of stuck out, so may be something I’ll look into after reading all the books I’ve ordered.