quantumflux wrote:Was gunna say. I dont remember posting a link.

That's because it was my post from yesterday.

My phone must've garbled user photos and posts or something.

I do think the information is as straightforward as it's going to get. I believe werewolves are very much like vampire in the sense that the bloodline has been blended with humans and is next to nonexistent in ability or prevalence at this point, but that yes indeed they were around as their own race at some point. Pureblood, if they still exist, would be exceedingly rare.

CH defines Earthen Realm as planet Earth. They do not discuss an alternate Earth or levels of the Earth, so I don't accept that. If that were the case with any spirits originating in this realm they would have discussed that a long time ago alongside every other race's description and/or "where do they come from" FAQ posts. I'm not saying it's not possible at all, but I don't accept it from CH's explanations of their source of spirits.

We know, as best that we can know, that we definitely have the spirits of werewolves in our keeps (those of us that do). Speaking only about CH conjured spirits that means they come from the Earth. It also means they are the spirits of once living beings.

Then I've seen it also posted that a werewolf spirit conjured by CH is a pureblood werewolf unless specifically noted otherwise.

All of this just means that our werewolf spirits from CH came from a time on Earth when purebloods existed or at least were still surviving. I would venture to guess that could be from any point in time where stories of werewolf activity were perpetuated, under the extreme assumption that some myth and legend has basis in local experiences.

As multiple cultures have similar legends of various were creatures I believe there is a seed of truth in there being some races that lived, as Alys suggested, that to some extent had traits of animals and humans combined. I think there's plenty of stories referencing shapeshifting as well, but I'm not going to argue on that point since my position is well-established has already been dismissed as impossible (a point I disagree on).

The long and short of it is, spirit-wise, from CH, I think we can be certain of their origin: The Earth, a long time ago.

With lack of further detail we either accept that and communicate with our spirits to discover more, or we reject it and do likewise. One way or the other our spirits will eventually share where they came from.

Regholdain wrote: CH defines Earthen Realm as planet Earth. They do not discuss an alternate Earth or levels of the Earth, so I don't accept that.

Something like this?:
post427047.html#p427047

Well, well nice find. I've been looking for that sort of tidbit ever since they told me my gift was plane walking. I'm surprised I never came across it.

They still don't mention that their conjuring picks spirits up from different plane and dimension combinations in the Spiritual realm. Of course that doesn't mean they couldn't, but it doesn't make much sense to me.

In most race descriptions, when they are from another plane CH outright tells you. "A race of vampire from the astral..." and such. They have always been particular that these sorts of details are shared with potential buyers.

The thing is, they don't describe this as something in the werewolf race description or the individual spirits' descriptions, either, and I would think that's an important thing for a spirit keeper to know. You know, like by the way this spirit isn't from this dimension so don't bother trying to find out about its life because you can't relate and it won't say anything that makes sense? Because you know those spirits wouldn't have a clue about our particular plane and dimension either?

That's a pretty huge oversight of a conjurer to make if it were true. A huge assumption also that it wouldn't matter to a keeper. A piece of information that big could make the difference in making good connection with the spirit.

I don't think that's the case, though. They don't tell us the werewolves are from another plane/dimension and that's not the type of information CH normally glosses over.

I don't find it particularly convincing that they didn't or don't exist in this plane and dimension at all besides. That doesn't seem to be a foregone option and it wouldn't make sense to summon a werewolf spirit from another plane/dimension when they lived and died here too.

Hell, if I were CH and that was the case I would sell multiple bindings of races of werewolves from different planes/dimensions, not just this one. It wouldn't make sense for that to not be an offering, or like a dropdown option in the store.

So yeah, it's a fascinating discussion, but I'm not convinced they are from a different plane/dimension by default.

Then get a living entity werwolf. If its from this plane you will find out quite fast.

I think we need to broaden our search beyond CH in order to get the best answer here. If wercreatures did exist on this plane i would think there would be a common denominator within the folklore. There would be evidence. After all even if they were good at hiding it or whatever someone somewhere had to skrew it up right? After all they are part human and humans make mistakes.

quantumflux wrote:Then get a living entity werwolf. If its from this plane you will find out quite fast.

I think we need to broaden our search beyond CH in order to get the best answer here. If wercreatures did exist on this plane i would think there would be a common denominator within the folklore. There would be evidence. After all even if they were good at hiding it or whatever someone somewhere had to skrew it up right? After all they are part human and humans make mistakes.

Once again you voice my thoughts before I can. That said, broadening horizons beyond CH as a source is good for almost any topic - not just this one, - and I'd immagine most of us have done so already for a multitude of things. That said, CH is a source and we do buy from them, so seeking direct clarification of "Yes the ones we conjure are from our earth we live on currently" or "No, they aren't they're from ___" feels appropriate. Especially since some might not be as skilled as them and therefore might not be able to speak with a Werewolf directly conjured by them. Not even after five years of bonding - as everyone develops their own gifts differently, and they're one of few long standing conjurerers that seem to have a very definite and direct link to the Spirits they conjure.

That all said, once again, I see no shame in seeking direct answers...but I agree in saying answers in general can be found everywhere. The problem is, that because our question has to do with a specific conjure and not just Werewolves, and because people could be conjuring Werewolves from different places, our answers would always be subjective if we were looking for just a general answer. It needs to be a clarification from CH themselves, if what we're asking has to do with what they conjured specifically.

Regholdain wrote:The thing is, they don't describe this as something in the werewolf race description or the individual spirits' descriptions, either, and I would think that's an important thing for a spirit keeper to know. You know, like by the way this spirit isn't from this dimension so don't bother trying to find out about its life because you can't relate and it won't say anything that makes sense? Because you know those spirits wouldn't have a clue about our particular plane and dimension either?

That's a pretty huge oversight of a conjurer to make if it were true. A huge assumption also that it wouldn't matter to a keeper. A piece of information that big could make the difference in making good connection with the spirit.

I agree with this to a degree. I think it's important for a Keeper to get all possible information that the conjurer has about the Spirit they conjured ESPECIALLY if it's a custom conjure. I get that some Spirits like to leave out information for the Keeper to find and that's nice, but I feel that should be voiced as well, as I doubt a Spirit would want to hide everything and even if they did --- I'd want to know it so I could spend time focusing on that. As like some, I have no way of direct communication as it just isn't in my skillset at this time, so I am always going to go by instinct and make guesses and hope I'm at least CLOSE to where they're guiding me. Sometimes I'm right, sometimes I'm wrong. I'd like a better way to gauge this either way. It's better than stumbling around in the dark. If at the very least I knew they didn't want me asking conjurers, then i simply wouldn't, lol.

That all said, if the Spirit didn't voice they wanted certain information left out, I see no reason for it not to be sent to the keeper. This goes towards any seller by the way. Having a template ready and jotting down a Spirit's information either before or after the binding so that it can be sent with the order would be so useful. I've seen many members of this forum go to painful lengths and wait almost a month or more for simple information on their Spirit simply because as far as I know, the information wasn't prepared beforehand. This is a flaw in most systems concerning the sale of Meta products and it really does need a tune up. Lest we have threads like this that spend days questioning things when all could be solved in just a single email before/after purchase.

There’s a great discussion on the amount of information provided about individual spirits here: topic71828.html?hilit=Brief%20descripti ... re#p736346

Im tempted to get a living entity WW myself. I think it would be cool to have another WW and i would like to see for my self if there is a difference between spirits and living entities as far as interactions go. If i end up getting one ill ask some questions and compare the answers to my WW spirit.