I personally had not worked with Satan or any Black Arts entities.
But here is a rational voice of reason: on a larger scale, many of the "facts" well known about Satan to the general public was a religious depiction fabricated by few people(in the books and movies). That alone can not produce an accurate description of an entity, or a person. As we already know many stories from the bible is "borrowed legends" from other cultures. If you look closely into ancient civilizations you will find traces of those stories, from hundreds if not thousands of years before the bible was even written. This means that the people who put those stories together did not really experience it themself. How is any judgement of a character fair if the describer do not even know the depicted? Would anyone here be content getting branded by a stranger?
Also, within history multiple religions and believes had been used as a control methodology.
If there is no evil, why would people believe in "the good"? If there is no consequences, why would anyone obey a rule? If there is nothing to fear, then why would anyone need to be told that doing certain things will grant us salvation? This is a simple "good cop, bad cop" game in which authorities had been playing for thousands of years, because majority of us do not question the ones in power.
With that being said, I am not defending Satan here in anyway since I also don't know him. But I do think that everyone deserves a fair chance, or at the least, to be given the benefit of the doubt.

Vipera aspis atra wrote: ↑Sun Nov 24, 2019 1:46 am Based on the knowledge I have and personal experience, I would go with the idea that 'Satan' is a title and there are many 'satan' figures out there. Meaning that those of us who engage a being we consider to hold that name could potentially be interacting with different entities.

It is true however that if one is already very opposed to the notion of Satan, that any interaction with a satanic figure may be unpleasant based on the push against that entity and what it could possibly represent, while an interaction by one more prepared with the same entity could be rewarding.

I wouldn't consider the title of Satan to be synonymous with the title of Lucifer unless we are maybe talking about Lucifuge, who can be considered the dark twin or dark 'half' to what Lucifer represents. Or perhaps were we to regard Lucifer instead as Moloch.
(In stating this I infer that I believe in a duality which may either be represented by two separate beings or a singular being, depending on what makes sense.)

This is not to rail against your experience of course, just lending my perspective. I can appreciate what you're saying so far as the truth is definitely more complex.

I agree with you as well. In my experience, everyone has their own experiences. It's never finite and to the point. All experiences are meant to be unique to each individual so they can suit us as individuals...

However, I also believed on Satan/Lucifer being two different entities. I was genuinely confused since I always relied on people's experiences since I was new. This was until I asked him directly in the astral plane. I was conscious as well. I've learned that people will perceive them with ideologies from different sources. The best thing one can do for themselves is to ask these entities directly. Just as I did.

Muse wrote: ↑Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:04 am I agree with both of the posts above to some degree. "Satan" is definitely a title as much as it is a being, and it really depends on the particular "Satan" that interacts with you to figure out what is what. For me, personally, "Satan" or whatever being displayed himself has such, has always been quite the stern but loving fatherly figure. He's never made me feel particularly uncomfortable in a way that caused permenant fear, upset, damage, etc.

Anything he did cause was for my own benefit in the long run (getting rid of a toxic individual for example) even if I didn't see it that way. He's very much an in your face type of being and, like all beings, can be percieved differently depending on the individual. Some may see him lovingly whereas others may be uncomfortable around him, and others still will downright fear him (and have every right to feel afraid). I think Akelta from S&S wrote a beautiful story about her journey with Satan, and I'll quote a small bit of that here in hopes that it provides some further insight...

Many people will pick and choose. They think it is something they can. They will not leave their home, they won’t dwell in the cave, they do not know the symbolism or why any of the rituals are done. The double-bladed knife that is walked when one is exploring the darkness. That is where the darkness will destroy you. If you want to roll in the filth you have to be willing to ingest it. If you want to watch others being abused and destroyed you have to accept that you yourself will be abused and destroyed. The second you can accept things it changes you and takes from you.

Satan: How much can you take? How much do you want to take? What is natural to you? These are very important questions you have to ask. To watch others be abused you have to be abused, to watch innocence be destroyed you have to accept your innocence will be destroyed. There are many paths of darkness and they do not have to all be destructive. Just because all things are divine, doesn’t mean you have to be ok with it.

For those that think they just have to destroy themselves in a ritual of self-cannibalism, they do not know the layers of the darkness, there is not just one path, there are many..

Satan: Not all paths of darkness are like that, you cannot and should not walk all of them, you have to find the one that is aligned with you. Your darkness has always been natural to you, don’t feel you have to push into the ether, crossing your boundaries and shattering who you are.

I think that to get the true and beautifully detailed message you must read her full Article for yourself, but generally speaking, I feel that this was a grand depiction of not just Satan and her personal bond with him, but of the concept of things being not as they seem, and of how paths, experiences, and even beings - dark or light - can be a highly unique experience to have.

I appreciate you're response and your experience. I've stumbled on the S & S websites and her listings are very interesting. Incliding her stories as well. However, in my experience all I did is learn all I could then throw everything out the window and experience the entity with no strings attached.

Since I talked to Satan/Lucifer, I learned a lot from him. Some of the information I even read about him/her didn't resonate with him/her. Sometimes he/she was even offended at the questions I asked. Mind you these knowledge came from people who have been on this path longer than I have.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't trust other people's teachings. It's better to find answers yourself. With time you'll find people who also asked their questions directly too. These people will relate more to you're experiences and questions more than the people who comprehend an idea in their mind of who Satan/Lucifer is.

Truth_B wrote: ↑Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:00 am For me... As I began learning about him, I discovered that Satan/Lucifer, has many aspects. They don’t consider themselves to be the same, even though they come from an original source.

His aspect can be Prometheus, Samael, etc.

Everyone who chooses to work with these forces will have a different experience. These experiences are meant to be different because we are all different and need different requirements to attain certain and different goals.

In all truth, it is always up to the individual to find out the truth for themselves. By asking these Gods directly can be a positive start. Instead of just judging them through people’s views and experiences.

To me, I take everything I learn as a grain of salt. Then I experiment with what I have learnt to find out the truth. That’s how things have worked for me so far.

I agree with this wholeheartedly... For me, it's the same thing. Even though his/her aspects are Shiva, Hades, Sutekh, Enki, etc. He told me he/she answers to all names equally since that's what humans have evolved to call him throughout the ages and cultural backgrounds.

Even though he told me this doesn't mean that I would summon Shiva the way I would summon Sutekh. Even though he told me not to worry about it, I still take it seriously.

Aprophis wrote: ↑Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:06 pm I'm kind of bothered by your use of religion.
There are a lot of religions out there, like buddhism, hinduism, whatnot, that do not necessarily have the devil or satan as the opposing force.
Not to mention the religions that actually are satanic or luciferian.
Just call it christianity or whatever.

All religions have an opposing force. Light and Dark. Balance is maintained in all aspects. These are the laws of the universe. Even religion will show duality. It's in all things. Please research, Hinduism has an opposing force like the Goddess Kali, etc. All religions have an opposing force.

Vipera aspis atra wrote: ↑Sun Nov 24, 2019 11:15 pm Good point Apro.

But for a bit of a twist I will add in fact, while I am fully immersed in the demoniacal I've over the years expanded my awareness enough to be comfortable exploring many Abrahamic concepts, have prayed to Saint Mary (she is very fond of me for some reason, maybe she's that way with everyone), etc.
It is an interesting position to be in, since many persons who become involved with Satanism (whether 'RHP' or 'LHP' Satanism as there exists both) are fleeing from Abrahamic religion, while in my Satanic practices I've ultimately been led to really appreciate facets of Christianity.

For that matter, we can interpret biblical text in many ways. I don't see why there even has to be a 'good vs. evil', theologically.

It doesn't. I just wrote that article from my experience. Some people mesh into those ideologies other people don't. I've talk to Lucifer and he/she has told me not to be bothered by them if I don't want to be because all religions are one and the same. They may have a different structure but they have similar goals. He/She always tells me to follow the path I'm meant to follow.

Truth_B wrote: ↑Mon Jan 18, 2021 1:33 pm Please research, Hinduism has an opposing force like the Goddess Kali, etc. All religions have an opposing force.

Goddess Kali is an opposing force to what exactly?
She is dualistic, embodies good and bad, just like Shiva does. They are much more complex to just be reduced to opposing forces.
Sure everything is in balance, but you can't really say there is this side and there is the other side and that's it.
There are religions who have lots of sides. Not just good vs evil or light vs dark.

Aurum wrote: ↑Mon Nov 25, 2019 3:14 pm

Vipera aspis atra wrote:Good point Apro.

But for a bit of a twist I will add in fact, while I am fully immersed in the demoniacal I've over the years expanded my awareness enough to be comfortable exploring many Abrahamic concepts, have prayed to Saint Mary (she is very fond of me for some reason, maybe she's that way with everyone), etc.
It is an interesting position to be in, since many persons who become involved with Satanism (whether 'RHP' or 'LHP' Satanism as there exists both) are fleeing from Abrahamic religion, while in my Satanic practices I've ultimately been led to really appreciate facets of Christianity.

For that matter, we can interpret biblical text in many ways. I don't see why there even has to be a 'good vs. evil', theologically.

It seems 90% of people who are in the Satanic path often seem to be just reverse Christians, just changing their previous beliefs around. That is why I often have difficulties taking them seriously (this of course excludes the handful of serious practitioners I know).
I have a great aversion to religion but it may be that at some point I need to explore these ideas but I'm not looking forward to it. Jesus, if real, seems to be a cool guy, though.

This is true but you have to ask yourself as to why they left. It could be they were forced in to it against their will and had to live that way for many years, etc. Living untrue to themselves because of face or how society or their families view them. Some people don't have a choice.

Personally, I enabled a way for myself even thought the people around me don't have the same beliefs. I have many Christian friends and they respect my beliefs and I respect theirs. We don't word vomit on each other's beliefs to find out which religion is better.

All religions are connected. If you are close to deity you'll even find out you are practicing the same thing as other religions.

I've seen many people write and tell their experiences of working with Jesus. Some like him, some don't.

However, I respect these people wholeheartedly because they do what most don't. They ask directly without fear. Even if it means they have to open doors and get attacked with parasites and imposters. They're still hungry for knowledge. It's crazy... But their passion towards knowledge is inspiring.

I can share the links if you want.

Bluemew666 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:48 pm Jesus, if real, seems to be a cool guy, though.

If from what I put together makes sense I personally believe jesus was an enlightened alchemist who practiced WA and could have very well been someone who was affiliated to a god and or entity
[/quote]

One has to ask himself/herself directly. Only if you know how... I respect you views but the direct approach never gets old.

Truth_B wrote: ↑Mon Jan 18, 2021 1:14 pm It's better to find answers yourself. With time you'll find people who also asked their questions directly too.

I've spoken with Satan in dreams.
I've walked with Lucifer in waking.
Lilith has watched over me as a child while I slept...and continues to give silent motherly guidance to the rebelious adolescent I've yet to grow out of.

To put it mildly - I use quotes because I find that those with more experience tend to word things better, and offer things that I currently cannot.

That isn't to say I have not spent time with these immortal individuals, nor is it to hint that I do not learn from them. I just don't personally have anything relevant for this topic to share, as my lessons thus far haven't been to explore religious theory, but personal roots - particularly learning to nourish them, and cut out the metaphorical weeds. In that way, all of the names above (and some unlisted) have helped me.

But this topic is more of a debate of how one defines an immortal, and how historically He is negatively depicted. I'm sorry that you think that sharing wisdom from an Elder is not direct enough.