I'm curious about this and want to make sure I'm not passing my feelings and human concepts onto them. I purchased two duojnas recently. This first was pre-conjured in a store of someone I trusted. I felt really drawn to it, but because of the price and because I'm an impulse buyer, I decided not to buy him. Instead, I opted to have one custom conjured by CH instead and used the discount for your first time buy. While waiting for her to be conjured, I kept finding myself drawn back to this duojna. I was hesitant because the conjuror had the spirit listed as a "male duojna," and I'd researched that duojna are genderless.

When asking the seller, she explained the duojna presented itself as male to her and identified with a male name (M). I asked if she could hold him, but she stopped allowing reserves. So I told her that I'd the money on a certain day and that hopefully he would wait for me. Well, he did, and I took him home with me. After his purchase, I was excited. Well, it was around this time I began feeling like I was going to have a male and female duojna. I'd have one that presents as female energy, but I kept correcting myself, stating I didn't know that for sure and it's rude to push this idea onto a spirit and build up an expectation.

Well, the day my order shipped, I had this strange vision in the middle of work. All my life I've had an affinity for wolves and wolf-creatures. I'm 90% sure I was either meant to be a wolf, or my last life I was a wolf because I experience phantom ears at times "perking up" when interested or straining when I'm listening for something. Anyway, growing up, I wrote stories about wolves, and in early high school I came up with this character named L who was a she-wolf and had an unusual teal/aquamarine pelt. As soon as I saw this, I stopped and said outloud, "This is you, isn't it? This is what you want me to name you." I got this urge to look at the order and see what's going on, and to my surprise, it shipped THAT DAY and was updated around the time I got the vision. So that's what I've been rolling with and the pronouns I use.

So, after her arrival, I began getting this sensation that M knew L and a LOT of strong feelings there. When I think about them or try to envision them, I see them as inseparable, always side by side. I feel there's affection between them, and so I asked over the pendulum if they were mates when alive, and the pendulum replied, "Yes."

I just want to know if this is possible with these creatures. I don't doubt two former lovers finding one another in someone else's keep, but everything I read about these wonderful spirits is about how non-social they are and they are beyond our concept of gender identity and simply exist as they are. I don't want to offend them; this all sort of happened naturally. I remember when I bought M, I thought it would be cute if the CH conjure was a girl, but I wasn't living off this high of having a cute little pair or anything. It was an observation, maybe even the first sign as when I placed the order I was just like "Meh, whatever comes in, comes in." It just happened that way, I guess? I don't know lol. My life is strange.

I better preface this comment with 'I don't have all the answers and I'm no expert', as I do from time to time.

It may be that there's something different about the Duojna spirit found by the conjurer you bought from. Different from the CH beings, which are described as not being a spirit in the typical sense.

"Duojna are not quite a spirit and not quite a physical entity. "
https://www.creepyhollows.com/faq/index ... ght=duojna

When I read the CH description I think of a being that is the essence/ energy,
taken or copied, of a once physical being with magical power. ie Not their literal spirit.

I have a CH Duojna.

I notice that Mystic Morning Treasures describe Duojna as

"Duojna are spirit being manifestations of elemental energy. They have been known to manifest as wolf like beings but in truth they can appear in any form because they are beings of pure energy."

I think there's a strong hint somewhere amongst that info that those Duojna differ in some subtle or obvious ways from spirits and so may not exactly act like spirit beings. For a start, CH say they are non-social on the Shop page. And I remember seeing an experienced forum member's post in which they said to them Duojna feel a bit like created servitors do.

Putting together all of those things, I wouldn't expect CH or MMT Duojnas to be social or be the sort of spirit who could introduce you to their past loved ones etc...or mates...or who would recall that like 'ordinary' spirits may.

I could be wrong. What I know is limited.

In the same way Ace/Aro/etc people can date/etc, so can genderless beings.

I wouldn't be surprised at genderless beings having mates but it does seem weird from what I've read of the Duojna

Lewk wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 2:25 am I better preface this comment with 'I don't have all the answers and I'm no expert', as I do from time to time.

It may be that there's something different about the Duojna spirit found by the conjurer you bought from. Different from the CH beings, which are described as not being a spirit in the typical sense.

"Duojna are not quite a spirit and not quite a physical entity. "
https://www.creepyhollows.com/faq/index ... ght=duojna

When I read the CH description I think of a being that is the essence/ energy,
taken or copied, of a once physical being with magical power. ie Not their literal spirit.

I have a CH Duojna.

I notice that Mystic Morning Treasures describe Duojna as

"Duojna are spirit being manifestations of elemental energy. They have been known to manifest as wolf like beings but in truth they can appear in any form because they are beings of pure energy."

I think there's a strong hint somewhere amongst that info that those Duojna differ in some subtle or obvious ways from spirits and so may not exactly act like spirit beings. For a start, CH say they are non-social on the Shop page. And I remember seeing an experienced forum member's post in which they said to them Duojna feel a bit like created servitors do.

Putting together all of those things, I wouldn't expect CH or MMT Duojnas to be social or be the sort of spirit who could introduce you to their past loved ones etc...or mates...or who would recall that like 'ordinary' spirits may.

I could be wrong. What I know is limited.

See, this is what I thought. I just wonder if they appear this way to me. They sleep with me sometimes on the bed with my dog for protection. I can feel them curled up next to me and the weight against my legs and body, so I wonder if my affinity and love for wolves makes them want to appear in wolf form and remain that way.

I always get the feeling they're inseparable, and while I'm bonding with the one I ordered from my conjuror, I plan to keep their vessels close to one another. I wonder if maybe they stick together because they're working together to protect me. They're my main guardians right now, so maybe I'm pushing feelings on them. I'll ask for them to send me a sign/message however they can to answer this instead of using the pendulum.

Muse wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:00 am In the same way Ace/Aro/etc people can date/etc, so can genderless beings.

This makes quite a bit of sense, but I just found it odd that since they're basically light forms and pure energy that they'd want to form a relationship of some sort, especially since they're nonsocial. I know for sure, though, they know one another from a different time. I can feel this sense of "I know you" when I hold the vessels together.

santiesgirl wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:23 pm This makes quite a bit of sense, but I just found it odd that since they're basically light forms and pure energy that they'd want to form a relationship of some sort, especially since they're nonsocial.

I'd say it depends on the being themselves. Not all genderless beings are non-social, and even non-social beings might be reliant on definition of the term. For example, you could work with a non-social genderless vampire who'd be mated to something/someone else other than it's Spirit Worker/Spirit Keeper, or you could be working with a non-social Angel who's gender is dependent on the day if the week and literally doesn't give a crap about relationships/sex but is still close to its Keeper (just not very talkative). Relationships can be very fluid.

Of course, it also depends on your beliefs and how you even define a being to begin with. So, keep in mind that no one's opinion is absolute. We're all on the same path of discovery.

santiesgirl wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 5:23 pm [...]
See, this is what I thought. I just wonder if they appear this way to me. They sleep with me sometimes on the bed with my dog for protection. I can feel them curled up next to me and the weight against my legs and body, so I wonder if my affinity and love for wolves makes them want to appear in wolf form and remain that way.

My Duojna also seems like a dog-like wolf, appears nearby and sits or lies down near me or travels with me in the street. I think it's a common manifestation.

On a higher level, I think spirits kind of use these manifestations because they work well for us humans - we can relate to them. But they are genuine manifestations. Spirits can also manifest as orbs etc (see CH's Encyclopedia pages). It's hard to say which - if any - is the 'real' them. I think all manifestations of a spirit are equally, validly them.

Muse wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:11 pm Of course, it also depends on your beliefs and how you even define a being to begin with. So, keep in mind that no one's opinion is absolute. We're all on the same path of discovery.

This is important to remember. The Forum's whole ethos is about embracing and respecting all beliefs. It's not a place where any of us need to push one perspective as being Right and others as Wrong.

I'll stop there before I go on at length about Robert Anton Wilson and model agnosticism. But basically, it's okay to not be sure what's going on with the Universe, the Meta etc. We don't need to be absolutely Certain. It's fine to have strong suspicions though.

Lewk wrote: ↑Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:56 am I'll stop there before I go on at length about Robert Anton Wilson and model agnosticism. But basically, it's okay to not be sure what's going on with the Universe, the Meta etc. We don't need to be absolutely Certain. It's fine to have strong suspicions though.

Exactly.