The dangers of BA, and a story.

[Drake]

Exactly, if I am going to be a god I'd be like this guy: http://oglaf.com/assorted-fruits/

[Kahlal]

Found this quoted in another thread...both good reminders for a newbie like me. Never knew about branding and it's permanence till now. So thankful I didn't dabble in this back when I didn't know the ok's and not ok's of magick.

[Ashino Tsume roshi]

My View is simple, and my belief is that this is the only way to be totally safe with what is called Black Arts and what is called Dark Arts.

The Answer in 4 steps, in any order. Before before begining any DA or BA practices, do the following:

1. Master the Qabalah
2.Understand Basic Psychology (Thus authors: (1) Noyes & Kolb; (2) Carl Jung; (3) Herbert Silberer.
3.Understand the Basics of Transcendental Magick: (authors: (1) Eliphas Levi; (2) Franz Bardon.
4.Read the boosk: Maldoror by Comte de Lautremont; Psychic Self Defense by Dion Fortune.

In these fields, we all move away from quick fixes, and "5-minute Learnings."

Caiyros

[Likes2Read]

What is it with people with delusions that others should worship them.

Don't they understand how much WORK is involved in being a god? I mean seriously. Who would want that kind of responsibility...

And the WHINING... OMFG the WHINING...

No, thank you... SO not my dish.

People worshiping you is a one way trip to trouble. First they worship you, and then they think they own you and you owe them something for their troubles, and then you have to put out. Bleh.

Don't forget, "And then they all concoct their own, skewed versions of you, based on what they want to believe, and start fighting amongst themselves over which version is THE right one." I'm with you -- that's a great big NO THANKS to that!

[Likes2Read]

My View is simple, and my belief is that this is the only way to be totally safe with what is called Black Arts and what is called Dark Arts.

The Answer in 4 steps, in any order. Before before begining any DA or BA practices, do the following:

1. Master the Qabalah
2.Understand Basic Psychology (Thus authors: (1) Noyes & Kolb; (2) Carl Jung; (3) Herbert Silberer.
3.Understand the Basics of Transcendental Magick: (authors: (1) Eliphas Levi; (2) Franz Bardon.
4.Read the boosk: Maldoror by Comte de Lautremont; Psychic Self Defense by Dion Fortune.
In these fields, we all move away from quick fixes, and "5-minute Learnings."

Caiyros

Our society is laboring under the curse of wanting instant results. Take an eight-hour workshop to become a shaman. One weekend New Age retreat and a certificate later, and you're a pro and can set up shop doing whatever. "But I know all about the fad du jour! I'm an expert, I read a book!" As if these brief touches on the topic render people equal in proficiency and knowledge with those who've spent YEARS studying and practicing.

I don't recommend dallying with the things that can blow up in a person's face without knowledge if protection, and of how to extricate oneself from a situation that's going downhill fast.

And protection includes protecting your loved ones who could end up in the line of fire, through no fault of their own.

[NyctophiliaRaven]

What is it with people with delusions that others should worship them.

Don't they understand how much WORK is involved in being a god? I mean seriously. Who would want that kind of responsibility...

And the WHINING... OMFG the WHINING...

No, thank you... SO not my dish.

People worshiping you is a one way trip to trouble. First they worship you, and then they think they own you and you owe them something for their troubles, and then you have to put out. Bleh.

Don't forget, "And then they all concoct their own, skewed versions of you, based on what they want to believe, and start fighting amongst themselves over which version is THE right one." I'm with you -- that's a great big NO THANKS to that!

There's that, too. Totally true. I never COULD stand the bickering of idle children. There aren't enough corners for all the noses that need to be in time-out right now. **

[NyctophiliaRaven]

My View is simple, and my belief is that this is the only way to be totally safe with what is called Black Arts and what is called Dark Arts.

The Answer in 4 steps, in any order. Before before begining any DA or BA practices, do the following:

1. Master the Qabalah
2.Understand Basic Psychology (Thus authors: (1) Noyes & Kolb; (2) Carl Jung; (3) Herbert Silberer.
3.Understand the Basics of Transcendental Magick: (authors: (1) Eliphas Levi; (2) Franz Bardon.
4.Read the boosk: Maldoror by Comte de Lautremont; Psychic Self Defense by Dion Fortune.
In these fields, we all move away from quick fixes, and "5-minute Learnings."

Caiyros

Our society is laboring under the curse of wanting instant results. Take an eight-hour workshop to become a shaman. One weekend New Age retreat and a certificate later, and you're a pro and can set up shop doing whatever. "But I know all about the fad du jour! I'm an expert, I read a book!" As if these brief touches on the topic render people equal in proficiency and knowledge with those who've spent YEARS studying and practicing.

I don't recommend dallying with the things that can blow up in a person's face without knowledge if protection, and of how to extricate oneself from a situation that's going downhill fast.

And protection includes protecting your loved ones who could end up in the line of fire, through no fault of their own.

I completely agree with both of you...

Shamanism is something that takes a lifetime to learn - and honestly requires certain significant experiences in most cultures in order to qualify - a weekend workshop certainly doesn't make a fili (Celtic Shaman), as I well know - here's an article that talks about the definition of the word "shaman" these days: http://www.druidry.org/library/members- ... ltic-world as it's become rather a "buzz word" in many circles. In other words, I feel your pain \ And please, let's not EVEN get me started on conjuring for profit - or, you know, offering any magickal service for profit, really. lol Shoot, how many people get their reiki attunements longdistance from some online class and have no idea what the original Usui school teaches, but think that what the socalled descendents are parading for them is the real stuff?

Alas, in a world where 140 characters is considered "communication," and a country has redone part of its infrastructure to make way for a people who cannot pull their faces out of their cellphones long enough to avoid running into things (yes, China really created a "slow lane" in one of its cities for texting pedestrians), it's not just about "right now" results and "five minute learnings." We are becoming a global civilization trained to have ADHD, to memorize and regurgitate only what is irrelevant, meaningless babble shouted at us from all sides as we narrow our focus down so far that we cannot see where we place our own feet and the risks posed.

Books go the way of the dinosaur, reading likewise - when you can tell your phone what you need and it can answer you, and Google is the God with the Answers to Everything, the issue becomes even more painstakingly clear.

We scholars with our passionate love of the scent of leather and ancient inks, and the secrets offered up like a chrysalis offers up a butterfly to the first light of a new life?

Well, what do we know of this world. We're fools, every one of us. Antiquated, quaint, and probably secretly huffing the glue that holds the bindings together. What else would you do with those silly things, anyway? Read them? HAH!? Don't make those tehcnoaddicts laugh.

It's ok. When they get caught with their pants down because their phones get possessed, we'll have the last laugh. They'll be coming to us to ask how to do exorcisms, because we DID learn to read and kept safe for them. \

[Ashino Tsume roshi]

I think the problem is more in the realm of:....When a lot of people talk about something they are doing, or like, or think important, or is publicized to a great amount of words and times - that we should acknowledge it, but then put it aside, and search yourself/inner mind/intuition to see what and find where - thaat "what you really connect with" and go in that direction.

Also, in the greater sense of the world we live in, dark arts (which is poorly defined, and with a lot of variable levels) has its limitations. Note that protectors exist in many forms that are not in the dark arts.I have some very strong protectors, and I don't categorize them as Dark Arts.

I hope this helps,

Caiyros

[ennaralee]

Reading this post makes it really sink in how much I do not know and how much I have yet to learn. Not that I would even consider working with BA at the moment or at any time in the future. At this point I do not think I have the skills or knowledge to even work with DA.I would consider my knowledge base at beginners 101 at best. The main problem that I find myself facing is not finding references that are above a 101 level. I have been searching for a teacher for years with no luck.

So having topics like this really helps a newbie like myself put things in perspective and serves as a reminder to not bite off more than we can chew. So thank you for your experience in helping guide those who do not have that experience.

[NyctophiliaRaven]

I think the problem is more in the realm of:....When a lot of people talk about something they are doing, or like, or think important, or is publicized to a great amount of words and times - that we should acknowledge it, but then put it aside, and search yourself/inner mind/intuition to see what and find where - that "what you really connect with" and go in that direction.

Also, in the greater sense of the world we live in, dark arts (which is poorly defined, and with a lot of variable levels) has its limitations. Note that protectors exist in many forms that are not in the dark arts.I have some very strong protectors, and I don't categorize them as Dark Arts.

I hope this helps,

Caiyros

The biggest issue being that when people dive face first into the black arts, most of them are NOT of the personality that thinks first, that deeply ruminates, that looks within... Instead they are of the archetype that functions on an emotional high, that believes that the world is against them and that they must strike first and hard, that their feelings and perceptions are the only ones that matter, that they are the most wounded, their desires and wounds are the most dire and of most import. There's not a lot of deep consideration there... it's all hormones and no philosophy. Which is, after all, why stories like this happen, and why they evolve to their eventual conclusion while we all shake our heads and tut-tut with such wise superiority, having seen this song and dance so many times before. Which just furthers their irritation and passion to scream their pain to the stage and screen because they're not like all those others, they're powerful, they're better, they're smarter, they're whatever they've been tricked into believing by their egos this week. \

The point being that WE are capable of putting it aside... but they are not... or they WOULD. I see a lot of people learning from this thread, and that's good.

But N didn't learn because he'd already fallen. Is still fallen. His whole purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others. Which is great for everyone who reads this thread who gets it... but what about the people who are still going to be like him, who will just say he was a fool, and they're not like him, they're smarter than him and they won't make the same mistakes? Who will make different ones, sure, but will still end up being a warning to others? Who won't learn anything from this thread because they'll be subject to their OWN egos... and will end up being the subjects of OTHER threads?

Because mark my words... there will be other threads in time. There's a sucker born every minute.

And you're right that protectors exist in forms other than the Dark Arts. I find it odd that this forum seldom discusses entities such as The Powers (Enochian) who break binding ties to black arts taint and/or demons, I've yet to find a well-rounded discussion on the LBRP or the GBRP or any of the hexagram rituals, and while I've found some discussions about voudon, there's little discussion about red brick dust, being more focus on things like hotfoot powder and the darker arts.

White Arts protections, passive and active, are incredibly powerful when used correctly. Walking the Third Road as I do, I use a blend of both, and there are several people who have come to me in times of need who have actually had to call me on the phone to get permission to come in, because my wards and shields have denied them entry, and it would have been dangerous for them to cross my boundaries without that permission... and the reason had nothing to do with my dark arts barriers.

The two most protective entities I conjure are both white arts - the Temple Fu and the Quetzalcoatl Dragons (or Feathered Serpents if you like) - both are Immortal Demigods, both are fiercely protective, both are highly magickal, and if you've ever seen a god on a bad day mop the floor with something they don't want in their space, you know they don't mess around.

But angels and gods aren't the only things that are helpful. I hate to say it, because I'm not on board with all that New Age claptrap that's going around like an infectious disease - a friend brought over a book on "angels" that included Kali, Anansi, and the Morrighan. \ However, what the New Agers call "enlightened masters" and the Buddhists call Bodhisattvas carry with them a golden light that pretty much kicks sludge to the curb - if you call on the right one for the right problem.

I've also found Hindu deities to be helpful - especially Kali and Vishnu as Rama - both of which are very useful in destroying black arts demons, though be careful with Kali because She can get a little crazy if there are too many of them. Whiskey with a drop of blood in it helps to calm Her down. Vishnu is safer.

Keep in mind that not all Black Arts entities are demons - some come from a wide varieties of other places and cultures all over the world have legends about them, so study up on those legends - do your research. "The power of Christ compels you" doesn't work on most things... in fact, most things will laugh at you. Salt, iron, and fire work on ALMOST anything, but don't bet the farm on it... research is KING, so STUDY.

Dark arts can't handle everything. Angels and bible verses can't handle everything. Gods can't handle everything. You can't handle everything. Iron isn't for everything. Nothing works on everything. Pick the right tool for the job, the right entity or energy for the job. Even a Devourer, someone who eats black arts energies or entities, isn't right for everything - what if what you're being attacked by isn't black arts, or even dark arts? What if what's attacking you is yourself, or even (weird, but sometimes it happens) white arts? Sometimes we're tested, or even attacked, by angels... read the bible... you'll see that it happens. Don't assume anything - white arts CAN attack... and trust me... the fallout is every bit as brutal and ugly as black arts. Sometimes, I think it's worse... because no one expects it from the white... at least with black arts and dark arts, everyone's on the same page.