Looking For A Scientist-like Spirit to Learn About Magic

[ARandomDemon]

You do have strong and good point here @ ARandomDemon. That is why I bought geological books before I looked into crystals and gemstones healing properties.

I wanted to get the down to earth view of a science based approach and understand the magic behind it afterwards. It's definitely not required to have a faith in a stone to heal.

I experienced it myself with my sceptic and scientists mindset. Rose quartz healing property is due to its crystal structure and not of its colour. Some rose quartz actually almost white. Only a infra-red light will show if it's truly that or something else. I could go on but you've got my pointer. Check in to Ash with a ticket and express your interest. I have a hunch that he is a great alchemic.

Yeah, about rose quartz having love properties despite its color... I've seen at least one source on the internet (don't know where) that says you can predict a rock's properties based on its color. All purple rocks are psychic in nature,pink equals love etc. Don't know how true that is but you see my point. Depending on how a rock was used in a culture, it may pick up another association like Amethysts were used to ward against drunkenness somewhere (Don't know where).
I did a quick google search on pink gemstones and their meanings. What does kunzite,morganite,pink tourmaline,rhodonite and Rhodochrosite have in common besides their pink coloring?
They all have love associations with it. Despite the fact that they are all different kinds of stones with different structures and grew in different environments they're all some sort of love stone or associated with the heart. Did a quick google search for the properties behind white rose quartz and no obvious ''properties of white rose quartz'' jumped out at me in the results. It's all just for pink rose quartz. For some of those pink stones,just find a different colored version of one of them like blue topaz or regular opal instead of pink and they change their meanings.

So it's pretty obvious that it's the color that dictates the meaning but somehow you can still use a rose quartz in love spells and they do their love magic thing. Why is that?
My theory would be this, somebody discovered a pink gemstone in the beginning and people noticed it. Magicians and witches based on their cultural background at the time, they immediately place this pink gemstone in the love category without necessary knowing what it's supposed to do. More and more witches work with this pink stone over the centuries and gradually, it gains love energy and its supposed associations behind it. Also since I also believe in a paradigm theory which basically says,
''Every religious and spiritual thing is real in one matter even if they all started man-made at one point. All beings and energy systems are connected to us since we ''created'' them. They already exist in a different plane if not a different universe but thanks to people's creativity, everything is able to travel to this realm and interact with people here since our ideas bridged the gaps across space and time to bring spirits here.
This DOES NOT mean that they are thoughtforms or egregores (but thoughtforms do exist too) but means they first started as just a thought in someone's head and then they ended up being real somewhere else. Kind of like drawing a red flower unicorn named Daisy and then it shows up one day at your front door. It already existed but you didn't know that at first. However, there are beings that have manifested onto this plane for centuries before we came up with a mythology or a name for them. Angels already had existed and appeared to us but we didn't know about Yahweh or Jesus Christ yet until we wrote them down. Of course the spirits will tell you that they and their spiritual system are real but still, they might've began as just stories to fill the gap in our understanding of nature.''


That's just my theory of how things work at the moment. Uh,Anyway, as people worked with the pink stone using their paradigms, the energies from those 'universes' gradually made their way into the stone and impowered them with the associations and energies you now know about today.
Problem is that it's going to be a real pain in the butt to figure out whether or not pink rocks had always have love powers in them without a time machine and a psychic.
First you would need to read the stone's energy in its ''before social construct state'' to see whether or not it always had love energy in it. Then you would need to track down the person who decided that pink equals love and monitor their mind to see what caused them to decide think that pink equals love. Did it come from the guy's spiritual beliefs at the time or did a spirit tell them that the rock had love energy in it? Did the love association come from the Goddess he worshiped? (Exp: Aphrodite is associated with pink therefore this stone is a love stone) Or was he colored by his own ideas at the time?
Maybe a random idea popped up in his head like ''Men give women pink flowers on this holiday as a tradition so I guess this rock has love energies in it''. or even a thought like ''This pink rock reminds me of women because of its soft and delicate color therefore its feminine and a love rock''
Either way, to prove the stone is or isn't something you'll need to go back in time to its discovery and pre pink is love era to find the stone in its natural state without its existence being tainted by people's magical expectations of it and before all of the spiritual paradigms had touched it.

I guess one way to test out the 'people's expectations color the energetic structure of the stone' theory is to magic a new kind of stone into existence that nobody's seen or heard of before and make up the associations behind it. Tell a bunch people that the rock brings luck in deer hunting since it's a rare hunting Goddess's favorite stone and other stuff. Ideally, the idea should make its way onto the internet and everyone should now believe it. Now ask people to read the stone's energy structure and if I'm right, people should be able to feel that it's feminine and lucky in nature even though everything was a lie.

I know I made a huge wall of text but I wanted to dive down into magic rocks and social constructs a bit more.

[Metheus North]

This is delving down the sociology and social psychology paths. Lots of research data has been compiled in the areas, including mass hysteria. Basically, putting a false dangerous material in the environment to observe reactions from people.

It's easy to produce a 'fake' product, like the luck in deer hunting crystals you described and get people to believe it. However, to get proper analysis would be a random sampling with criteria fit for practitioners in one group along with the control group consisting of non practitioners. There would be interviews along with surveys. The participants would also have experience in deer hunting.

I believe that this would be a better way of obtaining data. Just putting something like that on the internet will just invite tainted data. Like people putting negative reviews on products out of boredom or something.

Humans have this uncanny ability to believe anything that they hope is 'real'. Put blue food coloring in someone's drink, wait for them to drink it to announce that you poisoned the drink, and they will do just about anything to get the anti toxin. Horror movies like "Saw" is an example of this type of situation, except for the fact that it was 'real' danger.

Now, as you said, practitioners in ancient times could have just used their imaginations. I think that, unless you believe in the abilities, speaking with them is not that difficult. We don't need a time machine. We are able to speak with our ancestors, spirit guides, and other spirits about those questions.

Even with a time machine, and a psychic, it's easy to just that the observations were no good because of reasons x, y, z. Just because you witness something real does not mean you are going to believe it.

You mentioned Jesus. There were plenty of people that didn't believe in what he said or did, and still don't to this day.

So, I think I have given all the information you need. This is your personal journey. I doubt that anything said will be enough.

[ARandomDemon]

Forgot to clarify in my last entry that when I mentioned Jesus Christ as being an example, it doesn't mean that I believe that he was a real person. Maybe inspired by someone who actually existed but not a literal guy transforming water into wine. Still that fact doesn't prevent people from seeing the manifestation of Jesus Christ and him getting people to do things.

The thing about trying to observe the effects of magic in people that it's nearly impossible to get a 'control' group. You can't find identical people with a pure and clean slate at all. Even if you cleanse someone, there's factors that can't be changed like soul traits,ancestor blood lines, astrology, inner astral anatomy and much more.
Metaphysics is complicated because a whole lot of stuff can change people's energy or whatever. From minute details to signing your name in read ink means death in certain cultures affectedly giving you bad luck to being born with a soul with hundreds of different magical aspects in it. From drinking out of a energetically uncleansed drinking glass or eating a fruit ripened under the Capricorn moon, there are trillions of different aspects that can effect your life that nobody has control over. Some of those affects come from different universes and dimensions.
Everything controls everything and there's no stopping it. Even water that came out of our faucet can be different depending on what hour and day it is not mentioning what kind of energy went inside the river.
Basically every person and thing is constantly being hammered by a cosmic pinball machine and it's literally impossible to get a control group for an experiment. One person can have different variations of chakras than the other even though they work with exactly the same system.